Rod Liddle

Rod Liddle: Labour’s putting me on trial for thought crime

21 May 2016

9:00 AM

21 May 2016

9:00 AM

I got an email this week, from a chap called Harry, which began as follows: ‘I am writing to inform you that I will be carrying out the investigation on behalf of the Labour party into the circumstances that resulted in your suspension from the party.’ Harry went on to say that he will be ‘conducting interviews with witnesses’ and added: ‘I will also need a time when you are available for an interview.’ This last presumably as an afterthought: I suppose we need to hear from him. Anyway, at this interview (to be conducted in London, natch) I am allowed to bring along a ‘silent witness’ —someone who is not permitted to intervene on my behalf but can sit beside me with a consolatory expression on their face and perhaps hold my hand. Thinking about this later, I wondered if engaging a mime artiste might be the way forward. He could do his sad ‘I can’t get over this wall’ act as the cross-examination reached its furious crescendo and somewhere, offstage, a smirking OGPU thug loaded the bullets into a pistol. But now I have decided to bring my lovely cross-breed dog, Jessie, instead. I won’t describe her as cross-breed to Harry. I will say she is of mixed race, diverse and viable. Or just black, whichever is the most politically expedient. All of those descriptions are true.

I immediately told Harry I wasn’t aware I had been suspended from the party. This, I kind of knew, wasn’t Harry’s fault. I get lots of emails from the Labour party, along with hundreds of missives advising me how I can extend my penis length, stuff about signing petitions to stop the Tories murdering infants in their cradles, offers on brass saucepans from French cookware companies and a regular injunction to meet up with a lady in my area who is really anxious to have sex with me. Of all the spammed rubbish I get sent this last is the most depressing: the lady in question lives in Basingstoke, more than a hundred miles from my home. So she is the nearest living person to me who would accede to a sexual relationship.

The Labour stuff is also depressing — usually round robins from Corbyn telling me how well the party is doing, when we all know otherwise. That’s what I get for my £13 per month membership: a regular recital from the terminally deluded. Anyway, I missed the email — from a bloke called ‘Stolliday’, a great name for a Labour apparatchik. A day of stolidity. It told me I was being suspended for a blogpost I’d written for the Spectator website.

The email from Mr Stolidity cited the ‘language’ I had used in my blogpost, but did not specify which bit they objected to. I mentioned this to Harry in my next email.

I received a fraternal and illiterate response very quickly. ‘The investigation stage is the initial fact-finding section [sic] where I will interview you and any other witnesses (if appropriate) about the article it’s [sic] contents and any other documents that may come to light…’

So, I pointed out to Harry, I have been suspended before the ‘initial fact-finding section [sic]’. Guilty until proved innocent, then. Harry told me that being suspended from the party of which I have been a member for 37 years (with, admittedly, a brief abandonment when we invaded Iraq, a questionable foreign policy option in my opinion) was a ‘neutral act’ and did not ‘imply guilt’. I am not sure how my suspension could be seen as a neutral act. A neutral act, surely, would be to not suspend me. Suspending me, I reckon, is a partisan act.

I looked Harry up on Google. He is a Labour organiser in Oxford, where they’ve had a lot of trouble in the party with anti-Semitism. He runs; he is a runner. In marathons and half-marathons etc. He has a beard. He is in his early thirties, I would guess.

The blog to which Mr Stolidity took exception was about anti-Semitism in the Labour party. I had suggested that it was indeed rife among sections of the infantile white middle-class liberals and also among the increasing number of Labour Muslim activists and councillors. Perhaps it is my suggestion that many Muslims are not favourably inclined towards Jews that provoked my suspension from the party — certainly it provoked a furious diatribe from the congenital idiot and Guardian journalist Owen Jones, who described it, with his usual semantic flair, as ‘rampant racism’. Or perhaps it was my assertion that if the Palestinians were given Israel they would turn it very quickly into Somalia that enraged these new commissars. If so, then they themselves are guilty of racism and cultural imperialism. Obviously I meant that this would be a good thing, Somalia being an exciting and vibrant state with ever so much to commend it. I would live there tomorrow, given the opportunity. As would we all.

Listen: I see this interview as an opportunity. An opportunity to meet Shami Chakrabarti, who, having joined Labour a couple of days ago, is now leading its investigation into ‘racism and Islamophobia’ within the party while also trying to run the UK through her various other posts. And also a chance to apologise for having dared to suggest that any Muslim anywhere could ever be accused of anti-Semitism and to insist that my reference to Somalia was a dreadful mistake, for which I am terribly, grovell-ingly, sorry — I meant that they would turn it into Switzerland. I sometimes get countries beginning with ‘S’ confused.

I just hope that during this interview with Harry and the boys, which reminds me a little of the British Communist party’s disciplinary sessions in the mid-1950s — nobody mentions the word ‘Corbyn’. If they do, my silent friend — Jessie the Dog — will leap up and begin snarling and barking and may bite someone. It’s just how she is. Anyway, I will let you know how I get on.


Show comments
  • Rik

    Stay strong Rod,when MiniLove drag you into room 101 all you will face is Corbyn,not a rat mask.

    • Son_of_Casandra

      Difficult choice. One hour with Corbyn or one hour with a rat mask. On reflection, I’d opt for the rat mask.

  • IMBMB

    Hey Rod rather than the dog take a book. The look on their faces when you place your copy of 1984 on the desk should be priceless!

    • David Prentice

      Why? That’s their how-to manual.

      • logdon

        OK, try Camp of the Saints.

      • Leon Wolfeson

        Nope. Orwell was talking about your right.

        (The Party) “rejects and vilifies every principle for which the Socialist movement originally stood, and it does so in the name of Socialism”

        • David Prentice

          Yep. Ingsoc was totalitarian in nature, like all progressives.

          • Leon Wolfeson

            The Coalition described themselves as progressive, but that’s no reason to smear the term…

        • BARROSO

          How can the left still be so stupid not to understand that socialism always does this because it has such an inherent contradiction at it’s heart. That was what Orwell was driving at, as well as many other things. But I suppose by definition you have to be stupid to be supporting an idea that fails everywhere

          • Leon Wolfeson

            So PC bigotry against the left. As Orwell discussed you, as you say those failures in the Nordic…oh.

    • lordlindley

      and don’t forget to where your ‘I hate Stazi’s’ T-shirt

    • Hybird

      How about the Koran and Hadith with all the anti-Semitic (and anti-Christian) verses highlighted? There is no getting round the fact that IsIam is an anti-Semitic ideology.

      • Itinerant

        “Apocalyptic Islamic Jew-Hatred, from The Palestinian Mufti to The Iranian Mullahs”
        http://www.andrewbostom.org/blog/2013/11/27/interview-discussion-of-apocalyptic-islamic-jew-hatred-from-the-palestinian-mufti-to-the-iranian-mullahs/
        Sheikh ‘Atiyyah Saqr (died 2006), the Head of the Fatwa Committee at Al-Azhar University, wrote a book listing ‘ twenty evil qualities the Qur’an attributes to Jews’
        http://quotingislam.blogspot.co.uk/2012/02/top-islamic-authority-tells-main.html

      • Leon Wolfeson

        And how about the same for the Christian Bible?
        It wasn’t until recently that the Popes retracted the blood libel over Jesus.

        The reality is what most Muslims practice and believe is not hostile to Jews, the *Arab* hostility to Jews today stems from nationalistic factors (which hook back into British and Frence anti-Ottoman maneuvers).

        In fact, for many centuries Jews did better under Muslim rule than Christian.

        • BARROSO

          There is nothing at all in the bible about blood libel. It was a medieval myth used by popes and politicians to their advantage. There is however plenty in the Koran that is anti Semitic. As well as anti everyone else. A truly hateful book

          • ardenjm

            Actually, the Popes in the Middle Ages never made use of Blood Libel (it was Popes in the 18th century who referred to it, oddly enough) key figures spoke out against it, they nearly all condemned pograms and whilst the Papacy was in Avignon the Jews were afforded special protection – so much so that they were called les juifs du Pape.

            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blood_libel#Papal_pronouncements

            So, it just goes to show. We’ve gone full circle: we libel the Popes for Blood Libel when they criticised it themselves. But, when it comes to the Catholic Church we no longer need to make any effort at truth.

          • Leon Wolfeson

            Benedict XVI was the one who withdrew the claim.
            That’s a little after the Middle Ages.

          • ardenjm

            No. The article I linked to clearly shows that when the Blood Libels started emerging in the Middle Ages, the Popes were clear in their condemnation.
            Here’s another one – a Jewish magazine’s perspective – that is accurate, fair-minded and absolves the Vatican of stoking the fires of anti-semitism via Blood Libel.
            http://www.covenant.idc.ac.il/en/vol1/issue2/introvigne.html

            What I don’t understand is how, centuries later, right in the Enlightenment, some of the Popes gave greater creedence to it. Not sure why that is – probably something to do with fears about Freemasonry I suspect.

            As for Benedict XVI withdrawing the claim, I think you’re confusing the Blood Libel with the Deicide language of the Pre-Vatican 2 liturgies. That language had already been repudiated. Benedict XVI spoke on it in recent years and underlined why the Church couldn’t endorse that kind of language.

            I don’t plan to enter into any further discussion with you on this, Leon. You instrumentalise your religious identity in such a narcissistic way that any time someone criticises you you accuse them of anti-semitism. Take a look at the link, it’s intelligent stuff.

          • Leon Wolfeson

            And yet the core Catholic reasoning behind them wasn’t withdrawn until Benedict XVI did so – yes, there had been previous statements on the issue, but that one was actually meaningful in theological terms, I’m given to understand.

            Oh, and I note the Protestants were often worse – see “On Jews And Their Lies”, etc.

            PS, that “Jewish magazine”… lol. It’s a random website.

            You’ll of course refuse to engage in debate because of your issue with my using facts. I hear you, and agree it’s probably not religious, just your projecting your issues at me, simply because I’m not just like you as you defend thought crime views with a general slur.

          • MuslimJew

            “There is however plenty in the Koran that is anti Semitic.”

            ROFLMAO!! This noxious little bigot just called Yahweh a Jew hater!

          • Leon Wolfeson

            So you’re unaware of what the Bible said… Martin Luther drew on it for his rant, check.

            Your double standard is sad.

          • MuslimJew

            “So you’re unaware of what the Bible said… Martin Luther drew on it for his rant, check.”

            Which of Allah’s teachings in the Bible did Martin Luther draw on?

          • Leon Wolfeson

            You can’t even tell the difference between…oh dear.

        • MuslimJew

          And every time you mention Israel, Palestinians or Zionism…
          God kills a kitten
          Please, think of the kittens

          • Leon Wolfeson

            Every time you make that stupid claim?
            God kills a Domo-Kun
            Please, think of the Domo-Kun’s

    • hobspawn

      Take Mein Kampf, and read it while they interrogate you.

    • Leon Wolfeson

      Really? Why would be putting his manual…

  • John Birch

    Mind you , that Shami !!!. A couple of drinks , a bit of light hearted banter and who wouldn’t.

    • Roger Hudson

      I wouldn’t. Not with a bargepole.

      • greencoat

        Not with two barge-poles.

        • #toryscum

          Not with your barge-poles.

    • CockneyblokefromReading

      Ugh.

    • Bonzo

      Where can I buy what you drink?

    • WimsThePhoenix

      A profile is no indication of a frontal portrait. There is a distinct lack of symmetry in her features that makes her anything but beautiful. A nice profile is not enough.

  • Trailblazer10

    Summoned by the Hatefinder general for an inquistion at the Human Rights Chamber.You will probably be sentenced to a cutural marxist reeducation camp and emerge reciting “White men are evil” and “diversity is strength”.

  • CraigStrachan

    Is it not about time you left the Labour Party, anyways?

    • WimsThePhoenix

      He should join UKIP like any sane person who cares about this country.

  • putin

    Hilarious. The left, completely self unaware and beyond parody, again. Did they read Animal Farm or just think it was a children’s book? Socialism: it starts like this and ends in Venezuela. Always.

    • Mike

      As someone pointed out in another discussion; some people regard 1984 as a road map rather than a warning.

  • jack

    Rod, leave the dark side, leave. …

  • 70sgirly

    Tell them to shove their Ingsoc membership, where the Sun doesn’t shine.

  • THE <

    The < approves of this article. Keep up the good work Mr L.

    • SonOfGud

      are you a kipper?

  • McCarthyism seems to be back , alive and kicking… it is the practice of making accusations of subversion or treason without proper regard for evidence. It also means “the practice of making unfair allegations or using unfair investigative techniques, especially in order to restrict dissent or political criticism.”

    Chin up Rod… tell them to take a hike!

    • WimsThePhoenix

      Only McCarthyism for anti- Muslim rhetoric, not anti-Jewish, it seems.

  • Wedgie Benn

    if they expel you for that article i’ll quit the party too

  • ohforheavensake

    Thing is, Rod, the article that’s caused the problem has been edited: and as Jonathan Portes is pointing out to Fraser on Twitter, this sentence-

    https://twitter.com/jdportes/status/733062595209515008

    – has been amended.

    They’ve got a point, Rod. What you wrote was nasty, offensive nonsense. Labour should get rid of anybody in the party who is anti-semitic; but that has to be a general rule. If someone gratuitously insults Jewish people, they have no place in Labour. And if someone, like you, gratuitously insults Muslims, they have no place in Labour either.

    • alfredo

      It was not ‘nonsense’, in that it was perfectly lucid and intelligible. To be ‘nonsense’ it would have to be like the outpourings of some – any – French Marxist ‘thinker’ (i.e., utterly devoid of intelligible meaning). Nor was it ‘gratuitous’, in that it had a clear and sincere purpose and the author clearly thought that it should be said for the public good. Try again.

      • ohforheavensake

        No, it’s nonsense, and vicious, nasty nonsense at that. I’ve got no idea what the reference to ‘some- any- French Marxist ‘thinker’ ‘ means. That seems to have come from nowhere.

        • polidorisghost

          “No, it’s nonsense, and vicious, nasty nonsense at that.”

          Odd. I found it perfectly comprehensible.
          I wonder how you managed to find it vicious and nasty at the same time as not understanding it.

        • alfredo

          It’s usual in discussions such as these to go a little beyond making dogmatic assertions, and provide a little evidence and the criteria on which you’re judging things. What is it that he wrote that makes it nonsense (it isn’t; it makes sense, even if you don’t like it), vicious, and nasty. If you don’t explain that, there’s little point in saying it.

          • WimsThePhoenix

            He calls it nonsense as a means of closing down debate on a very real issue. Anyone who reads the relevant passages of the Koran, a brutal text hammered into the brains of every muslim child, would know that anti-Semitism is a major part of it. I cannot believe that an atheist who uses the word “heaven” in his login wouldn’t know that, or have access to many of the muslim videos showing children pantomiming Jew-killing.

          • logdon

            They don’t provide evidence or rationally explain.

            For them it just ‘Is’. A bit like Descartes without the thinking bit.

            And they’ve been getting away with it for years.

    • Trailblazer10

      Are you familiar with the Islamic texts?

    • Teacher

      How is it ‘gratuitous’? Much of Islam wants Israel and the Jews wiped out while the Jews are generally tolerant and fit in with the societies in which they find themselves. Rod Liddle merely points this out. Labour is pro Muslim and anti Semitic on the whole. Given that Islam is a religion, medieval in outlook and unreformed, based on misogyny and jihad, Labour’s stance is alarming to all rational people.

      • Zalacain

        To all rational people and lovers of liberty.

    • FrancescaMacfarlane

      (Muhammad said:) The last hour would not come unless the Muslims will fight
      against the Jews and the Muslims would kill them until the Jews would hide
      themselves behind a stone or a tree and a stone or a tree would say: Muslim, or
      the servant of Allah, there is a Jew behind me; come and kill him;

    • WimsThePhoenix

      When you can glean as many as 3 votes per post, you won’t be such an obvious libtard troll.

    • WimsThePhoenix

      Portes is clearly an idiot if he conflates natural disgust with a totalitarian ideology that masquerades as a religion with racism.

      WHICH RACES? As far as I know, both Rod and the Bosnian muslims, who contributed an SS regiment during WWII (not known for their beneficence towards Jews) are both of the Caucasian race.

      You and Portes are both “progressive” types, an oxymoron indicating people who wish to achieve genocide-by-birthrate through massive immigration of people who do not wish to integrate.

    • patrickirish

      No it hasn’t.

      • Paddy Nolan

        Waddya mean by that Big Nose ?

        • Oriental Imp

          Who are you calling Big Nose, Big Nose?

    • Allosaurus

      Oaf quotes “evidence” from Portes, the noted fantasist and bogus academic https://spectator.com.au/2015/06/jonathan-portes-master-of-correct-politicalness/

    • Mr Grumpy

      So Islam is immune from criticism because it now forms part of Labour’s official ideology?

      • logdon

        Islam is immune from critisism because at the slightest challenge they riot.

        That is unless they kill you.

      • Maureen Fisher

        It is their official ideology!

  • greencoat

    Because of all we’ve seen, because of all we’ve said….

  • Peter Andrews

    If you want a witness (I read the “offending” article) I’m happy to oblige, Rod.

    • Wedgie Benn

      me too

  • Sir Johnny Foreigner

    Shami Shakrabarti advised the government in the late 90’s onwards to cover up and dismiss allegations of child abuse in Rotherham, Bradford, Keighley, Burnley, Blackburn and other northern towns.

    • Patrick

      Not that I don’t believe you, but have you a link to this as I have tried to find one. I would think if one was available her friends would have ‘lost’ or deleted any Internet reference to it. Her ideas on civil liberties never led to her trying to help suspected football hooligans from having their passports taken away before England away games. The fact most were white, might explain a lack of support from her for this gross infringement on someones basic human right not to be accused of a crime before they have committed it.

      • WimsThePhoenix

        The N@zi Council for the Confiscation of Liberties.

        • WimsThePhoenix

          I cannot believe that the Spectator now has to approve any post with the name of the National Socialist Party popular in Germany in the 1930s-1940s

          • MikeF

            Just refer to them as National Socialists – it is what they called themselves, it is what they were.

          • Son_of_Casandra

            It may be something in the standard implementation of Disqus. Quite a few sites automatically block the word N@zi, even sites which you’d think wouldn’t be bothered.

          • John Standley

            I prefer to use Gnat’s Eyes.

      • Mike

        She didn’t have a problem sitting on the same board as Gadaffi at the LSE.

    • sebastian2

      Take Patrick’s point below. Can you unearth any kind of reference to this? It sounds likely, but …………….. very interesting indeed if this could be highlighted.

  • MikeF
  • Teacher

    Give up on Labour. Yes, the Tories might murder infants in their cradles for fun and perhaps even nurse unacted desires, the devils, but they never mistake ‘it’s’ for ‘its’.

    • WimsThePhoenix

      You could not fit a piece of tissue paper between any of the policies of LibLabCon with respect to EU directives. While that is the case, belonging to any of the three parties is anti-UK. LibLabCon – the EUSlavery party.

    • sebastian2

      They also confuse their possessive pronouns: “ours” instead of “yours”.

  • kitten

    Oh how I loathe and detest the fraudulent bully that is Owen Jones.

    Dare to confront him on his rank hypocrisy and expect to be blocked from his twitter feed, after he has tried to humiliate you. Manners matter not to him, politely disagreeing with him and pointing out why renders the same result.

    He pretends to be a socialist, you know, that ideology that supports nationalisation like the NHS and Royal mail, before its sell off, workers rights, fair wages and fights against austerity.

    Yet this massive phoney supports the EU which has austerity and privatisation (via its competition laws) written into law. This anti-democratic, supranational organisation also couldn’t care less about fair wages, it’s free movement policy has been shown to stagnate or reduce the wages of the poorest in our society.

    The EUs common agricultural policy adds 17% to food costs and its energy diktats are putting the poor into fuel poverty.

    In fact the EU is pushing the lest well off into further poverty.

    He calls himself a socialist champion of the poor, I call him a thoroughly unpleasant, bullying liar.

    • davidofkent

      Why would you want to be part of his Twitter feed? Have you nothing important to do with your time?

      • kitten

        Have you?

      • kitten

        I don’t want to be part of his twitter feed, what an odd assertion, he posted crap that I wanted to correct. Why should the remain camp get away with their constant drip feed of lies?

    • Jackthesmilingblack

      Sounds like a cyber stalker I had. He was deranged too.

      • kitten

        What “sounds like a cyber stalker”?

        Tales of a millionaire phoney blocking countless masses of people whilst pretending to be an advocate for socialism?

    • Nomad

      Well Owen Jones was born in 1984! (Really)

      • Bluesman_1

        Now that was a sex-crime.

        • 100

          I think the polite word was a mistake. The Labour party are always pushing the virtues of abortion. Its such a pity they dont work from home.

        • Nomad

          Preceded by a thought crime and succeeded by a health and safety issue.

      • Maureen Fisher

        And is the son of Militant activists – explains everything.

        • Nomad

          Worse still, he was a researcher for John McDonnell which might explain why McDonnell has so many wrong facts at his fingertips.

  • splotchy

    ……….congenital idiot and Guardian journalist……….

    Surely a tautology?

  • Peter Stroud

    Excellent article as usual, Rob. I thought Owen Jones was just settling down to life in the fifth form.

  • Dr Bock

    Good luck dealing with Kafka’s 1984 with added masochistic racism, Rod, you’re going to need it.

    • Zalacain

      What?

      • Dr Bock

        Rod’s trial’s Kafakesque and Orwellian processes, meeting the masochistic racism of the left, obviously.

  • JJD

    This is hilarious stuff as usual, Rod. But I just can’t square the circle. Why on earth were you still a member of the Labour Party? Surely it can’t be something so dull-witted as tribal loyalty… can it?

    • oldoddjobs

      Sunk cost fallacy, I reckon.

    • goodsoldier

      How can he allow himself to go through this process? It mystifies me that he even cares what they think or do. He doesn’t mind being questioned? He’s being as silly as a sorority girl.

      • JJD

        Amusement, curiosity… I don’t know. Maybe he still thinks “this is my party, and I’ll be hanged if I’m letting you ninnies boot me out of it.”

        • goodsoldier

          I suspect it is a self-advertisment that ‘I still believe in social justice and am a caring person’. Even an intelligent man like Liddle cares what other people think and wants ‘to be a good person’, the most fashionable fraud that’s been going on since the 1960s. The really good people are usually quiet about their goodness and grim. The right hand doesn’t know what the left hand is doing, or something like that.

          • JJD

            I don’t think virtue-signalling is really part of rod’s personality, myself.

          • goodsoldier

            It’s deep in the make-up of the left wing. They have to compensate for their wealth somehow. I don ‘t like to think this of Rod, but he’s loyal to the Labour Pary so I don’t trust him no matter how much I may agree with many of his views. He ultimately plays it safe socially. It may have something to do with the wife.

  • sebastian2

    Rod, I guess, is already “guilty”. He will be suspended whilst someone invents a form of words that confirms such. “Dem Volksgerichtshof” of the current PC, anti-racist Labour Party will concoct the decision it requires.

  • And I didn’t even know that Rod was Jewish.

  • English Patriot

    Just count yourself lucky if after the show trial, sorry “investigation”, you aren’t hauled away to the Lubyanka prison and executed with a bullet to the back of the head for “crimes against the people”.

  • RavenRandom

    Why do you still pledge any sort of allegiance to this bunch of neo-Trots? I can only assume long habit has robbed you of the ability to reason where the Labour party is concerned.

  • Ahobz

    Rod don’t forget to suspend your contributions, while you are suspended. It’s a neutral act.

  • Revd Robert West

    At least you can think: the majority of the Labour Party and of the Teaching Profession seem to be quite unable to; and seem happy and smug about it too. Maybe this is why we are falling behind in the international league tables. But they do seem to be experts at, wait for it – Waaaaaaycissssm. It seems to encompass everything from male teachers and persons who know their subject, to those who are alert about the reality of Mohammedanism; things like Jihad, dhimitude, female genital mutilation and the sharia generally. I should regard being suspended from the Labour Party as a compliment, if I were you.

  • Jackthesmilingblack

    Test
    Suggest you advise Harry to *iss up a stick and try to avoid getting his hands wet.

  • JJD

    I’m reminded of one of Gene Hackman’s lines in ‘Unforgiven’:

    “Innocent? Innocent of what?”

  • LaurenceBoyce

    Hopefully Labour will soon come to their sense, realise what a monumental waste of time this is, and then just suspend you for being a prat.

    • Freddythreepwood

      If Labour suspended all their prats there would be no-one left to suspend.

    • Allosaurus

      Sparklng stuff.

      Can you fart in tune as well?

    • wibbling

      I’d suggest being kicked out of the Labour party would be a badge of tremendous of pride, much like banned by the guardian it would show you have principles, decency and a sense of honour and justice as well as common sense. Something Lefties lack.

    • Cyril Sneer

      Such a shame we can’t suspend Labour by a rope at the nearest lamp post.

  • Freddythreepwood

    Rod; I was going to advise you to tell them to stick their interview in a dark place, but who could possibly pass on the opportunity to meet the divine Shami. Do give her our regards and tell her we are looking forward to her coronation.

    P.S. Tell Harry his Mum says his dinner is ready.

  • Allosaurus

    I’m not really sure if I hope Rod fails or passes the Inquisition (do they use pins, or was that witchfinding?). Honestly, I see him as deserving something better than the modern Labour Party, now Britain’s most influential racist organization.

    Perhaps I’ll just wish him the outcome he would wish himself.

    • wibbling

      The modern Left are the racist, bigoted and abusive bunch imaginable. They just can’t accept it.

    • Karl W South

      As long as they don’t find his third nipple it should be OK.

      • Son_of_Casandra

        The fact he’s taking his familiar with him will be a dead give away. Or are familiars only cats?

    • Nick

      Excellent post Allosaurus,you took the words right out of my mouth especially where you describe Labour as Britains most influential racist organization.

    • Nomad

      It isn’t pins they use, it is comfy chairs. Usually when no one expects them.

  • 100

    Thought crime is extremely rare in the Labour Party.

    • John Clegg

      Brilliant comment, (Just hoping that you’re being ironic of course!)

      • logdon

        I think the emphasis was on ‘thought’.

    • balls

      Will anyone step forward and translate this gibberish into German?

      • 100

        Didnt you miss your Paris flight to Cairo.. shame.

        Come back to me with a sharpened pencil,. Then you might have a point.
        BTW. Upvoting youre own posts is very bad form, but then you fall well short of class dont you.?
        Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

        • balls

          100, how many reincarnations of your sad self are we being made to endure. Did you believe this was not obvious?

    • Neil Saunders

      Delete the word “crime” and that’s true.

      • MikeF

        Absolutely though in this instance Rod is presumably accused of ‘hate speech’ – just as spurious a concept but for the left that really does not matter.

        • Neil Saunders

          No, the narcissistic, “identity politics” left is very keen on pronouncing such anathemas against its sworn enemies (i.e. anyone who does not enthusiastically endorse all of its pet causes du jour).

          • MikeF

            Don’t disagree – merely making the point that the heinous ‘crimes’ that the left seeks to charge people with don’t actually have to exist. Simply to be accused is to be found guilty because the reference point against which judgements are made is their own estimation of themselves and not any external code of conduct.

          • Neil Saunders

            Sad but true, Mike.

  • JSC

    No one likes hearing the truth Rod, the truth hurts. I don’t know why you’d want to associate with that lot anyway, tell them where to stick their membership.

  • What does anyone expect from the Labourstine Party?

  • TrippingDwarves

    Why are they still called the Labour Party? Have any of them ever actually had a proper job?

    • 100

      Should be renamed Welfare Party. And bring your own booze!

      • grimer ᶠʳᵉᵉᵈᵒᵐ ᵀᵒ ᴼᶠᶠᵉᶰᵈ

        or ‘bring no booze and then scrounge off the people with manners’

  • Bwahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
    Oh Lord that’s hilarious.
    Witch hunter hunted.

    • Wedgie Benn

      which Lord His mate Lord Galsman?

      • Only you know who ‘Lord Galsman” is and why he is remotely related to this. I’d ask you not to tell me but I expect you will anyway.

  • Mary

    Labour was hijacked a long time ago; they no longer care to keep the mask in place.

  • Mr Grumpy

    What amazes me is that you lasted so long. Has a longstanding relationship with Diane Abbott ended in a messy breakup?

  • Oriental Imp

    Didn’t take long for the inquiry into antisemitism to turn into one about Islamophobia did it.

    • P_S_W

      Are you surprised?

      • Atlas

        Well Labour is basically the political front of Islamic State in the UK.

        • irina palm

          didums

          • Bill Kendall

            “Didums”, do you mean that the Right should have to put up with Labour’s racism and double standards?

          • Googlheimer

            So these Labour fascists aren’t going to take the delinquents to court are they, they are just going to get Shakra to wave with her finger, naughty naughty, and all is well again. So, what exactly is your problem?

          • Migru Ghee

            diddums

          • Leon Wolfeson

            Funny, Labour has acted on this. Where’s the Tories on this?

          • asherpat

            dhimmidums

        • Leon Wolfeson

          Those fantasies of yours…

    • Leon Wolfeson

      Well, people do insist in being very vocal about it.

  • Speedy

    Oh dear Rod,

    Doubleplus ungood

  • Dominic Stockford

    Save your time and money and tell them where they can stick your membership card.

  • SalmondFishing

    We wanted an investigation into anti-semitic behaviour in the Liebour party, now we get an investigation into anti-semitic behaviour in the Liebour party. You have nothing to fear, Rod – that would be my approach to this subject matter. Unless of course you know something we don’t.

    • Hermine Funkington-Rumpelstilz

      Perhaps it’s not an “investigation into anti-semitic behaviour” after all?
      Didums.

  • D J

    Dear Rod,Please ask Harry if he sees Venezuela or Pakistan as the model for Britain in the future.

    • Mr Grumpy

      Venezuelan economic policy blended with Pakistan’s achievements in the sphere of human rights and diversity. What’s not to like?

  • Nick

    Excellent article Rod and may I suggest that you take a couple of cucumbers with you?

    One for Harry and one for Chakrabarti.

  • Son_of_Casandra

    Instead of your dog Rob, why don’t you take something useful along with you, like an Uzi 9mm? The fact it’s Israeli will stand you in good stead when they ask what you’re carrying.

  • Sid Falco

    “He has a beard. He is in his early thirties, I would guess.”

    That would apply to “Shami” as well…

    • Andy C

      She might do brazilian.

  • Simon

    Why on earth Rod sticks with the Labour Party at all I still can’t fathom.

    I mean, you can argue that once upon a time it was the party that stood for the working class, the underdog, for making Britain an economically and socially fairer place, etc. etc. There’s a good case to be made that it was, once, all of those things, at least in the main.

    But those days are long, long gone. There have always been two Labour Parties, ever since the Fabians aligned themselves with the grass-roots of LRC, and injected their bohemian, pseudo-intellectual poison into what was until then a genuinely working-class movement. But the upper middle-class Webbs and their ilke never cared one iota for the circumstances of actual, flesh-and-blood working people, with their distasteful counter-revolutionary attachments to family and the Christian religion, not to mention their stubborn patriotism. They were just instruments, useful in bringing about the overthrow of all of these things. And by the mid-1990s it was obvious that Bloomsbury had almost completely destroyed or corrupted the working-class origins of the movement. They’d won, decisively – and not only in the Labour Party, but in almost all of the major institutions of the country through which they’d staged their long revolutionary march.

    No one knows this better than Rod, so why he continues to allow his money and his votes to prop up this wicked, lying party (which obviously despises him) is a conundrum.

    • Neil Saunders

      Very well put, Simon.

    • Adrian Harper

      Rod Liddle stays in the Labour Party so he can pretend to be objective. He has hated Labour for years. He was very friendly with Nick Griffin before the BNP implosion, Now he veers between ukip and the tories.

      • Wedgie Benn

        more legal writs being issued ,me thinks

  • stearl33

    You’ve got to laugh to keep from crying.

  • Bluesman_1

    Solidarity Brother, or Sister, or Other, whatever!

    • Neil Saunders

      Careful! In another six weeks it’ll be a “microaggression” to be so “plural”.

  • James Chilton

    The insufferable Owen Jones believes that reality is the puppet of his preferences.

    • 100

      Owen Jones like all insufferable children should be seen and not heard. Failing that no toffee for a week and no Tellytubbies, including John Prescott

  • John Carins

    £13 per month. That’s a bottle of gin. Are you mad? You are being ripped off.

    • MikeF

      For which he doesn’t get any more say in electing the party leader than someone who pays a one-off £3.

  • Karl W South

    Leaving aside the rights and wrongs of suspending Rod Liddle, you would think that as an organisation if you took the decision to suspend a journalist from membership you would make sure you handled it carefully. I mean you’d have to expect him to write about it.

    • Fraser Bailey

      You have to remember that the members at the heart of this particular organization are not noted for their intelligence.

  • Eques

    Never understood why Liddle was a member in the first place. He was forever sounding off on what he disliked about the party but never told us what he did like about it (and I suspect if he did it would turn out to be the aspects it shares with the Tory Party)

    And all the political opinions he voices are typically Tory ones, (calling people “Anti-West”, saying “It’s not racist to point out that….”, Complaining about immigration etc etc)

    • Neil Saunders

      I wouldn’t say that they were Tory; more Old Labour.

      • Eques

        No way!
        Why these recent attempts to paint “Old Labour” as this kind of aggressive, jingoistic right-wing nationalist party?
        When has it ever been that?

        • Neil Saunders

          The Party might not have been patriotic (which you gloss as jingoistic) in the Old Labour days but its rank-and-file members and grassroots supporters were generally socially and culturally conservative (sometimes excessively so, since many supported capital punishment).

          They would certainly have had little time (to put it very mildly) for open-door immigration or the identity politics of modern-day metrolibs.

          • MikeF

            Go back to those days and I think you will find that the countries that actually practised ‘real, existing socialism’, as the phrase had it, were pretty consistent practitioners of capital punishment. Socialists have never actually been particularly reticent about killing people.

          • Neil Saunders

            That’s a good point, Mike.

          • MikeF

            Thanks – though there is a difference between simply supporting capital punishment as a part of the law for crimes deemed worthy of it, which most people did 50-60 years ago, and some sort of affinity for harsh punishments as a symptom of generalised intolerance. Modern metrolibs actually do fall into the latter category for any crimes that they deem to offend their sensibilities – most obviously those claimed to ‘racially aggravated’.

          • Neil Saunders

            Again, I agree with you, Mike.

          • Eques

            You are describing Working Class Tories (or even Working Class National Front), not Working CLass Labour. What about them? The parties that they led were NOT right wing Nationalist parties! It’s actually kind of insulting to characterise the working class as a bunch of aggressive, territorial flag wavers obsessed with the Queen and having a second toilet.

          • Neil Saunders

            No, I’m describing Working Class Labour voters, however much of an embarrassment they may be to metrolib twerps like you.

          • Leon Wolfeson

            Tip – Bankers are not Working Class.

          • Neil Saunders

            The Labour Party, with its enthusiastic pursuit of neoliberalism, has shown far more indulgence towards bankers than towards the indigenous working class, Leon, so your point escapes me (assuming – always a huge leap of faith where you’re concerned – that you have one).

          • Leon Wolfeson

            Funny, I’m not a new Labourite. As you talk about the Celts, as you as ever deny that points other than your neoliberalism, which you’re so scared Labour will not follow, and i.e. make you pay tax…

        • Wedgie Benn

          Attlee ,Gaitskell, Callaghan, Ramsey Mcdonalds times, Left wing doesn’t mean liberal, in fact Socialism wasn’t even a LEFT WING idea in the 1920’s

          • Eques

            What about them? The parties that they led were NOT right wing Nationalist parties! It’s actually kind of insulting to characterise the working class as a bunch of aggressive, territorial flag wavers obsessed with the Queen and having a second toilet.

    • grimer ᶠʳᵉᵉᵈᵒᵐ ᵀᵒ ᴼᶠᶠᵉᶰᵈ

      “He was forever sounding off on what he disliked about the party but never told us what he did like about it”

      He had a career at the BBC. You can’t have one of those, if you’re not a member of the Labour party.

      • Adrian Harper

        The bbc news department is led by a close friend of George “double the national debt” Osborne. Jeremy “one nation tory ” Paxman, Dear Laura. The BBC is owned by Cameron Tories.

    • Oedipus Rex

      “…never understood…”

      That’s because you’ve never tried. For starters try reading his book Selfish Whining Monkeys – I know that’s going to be so difficult for your febrile ‘infantile left’ist sentiments, but you’ll survive clean and unscathed I’m sure.
      When you’ve done that, come back and give it another go.

    • Wedgie Benn

      its possible not to like the party you’re in,when you think most of the time, the opposition is worse. when were the Tories anti Neo liberal, economically or military intervention, when were the Tories against Iraq, when were the Tories in favour of unions or equality
      Funny Cameron and he Tories want more EU immigration, didn’t John Reid MP when home sec, say we must get away from the criticism of ,minorities or immigration without the accusation, that its racist to talk about it, as Peter Hitchens use to say he was anti the west for its hedonism,.

  • Roger Hudson

    Don’t worry Rod, Labour needs you more than you need them.

  • SunnyD

    This Harry character sounded like a lumbersexual (I love that word) from the way Rod described him, but if it’s Harry Gregson then I’m afraid the facial growth doesn’t quite qualify for lumbersexual status – perhaps more metrosexual (anyway, I digress) – I just hope if you do take your dog, make sure you feed him whatever gives him the worst gas.
    Oh – and put a stop on that direct debit. Labour lost the plot years ago…

  • CrestovaWren

    Quoting from this longer article:

    http://hurryupharry.org/2016/05/19/a-tale-of-two-suspensions/

    “The piece in question originally said:

    “For the Muslims the anti-Semitism is visceral, an ingrained part of their unpleasant ideology.”

    It was then changed to:

    “For many Muslims the anti-Semitism is visceral, an ingrained part of their unpleasant ideology.”

    That change is important, and it was right that it was made. Certainly, a religious ideology which incorporated antisemitism would be unpleasant. But that is not true of what all Muslims believe. The phrase “the Muslims”, on it face at least, implies that Liddle is ascribing views to all Muslims.

    Liddle’s new piece doesn’t acknowledge the change he has made to the original piece: but it should. It is arguable, on the face of the piece, that he was talking not about all Muslims when he said “the Muslims”, but simply saying that antisemitism “is absolutely endemic” within the Muslim “sections of the Labour Party”. Therefore, “many” conforms to and clarifies this earlier statement.

    It was in any case right to amend it.”

    • splotchy

      It would therefore be equally right for all commentators or politicians to avoid similar sweeping collectives, such as: “Men”, “Whites”, “Toffs” etc when they write/speak? Not that barely any of them do. When Polly Toynbee collectively referred to “The Tories” wanting a “final solution for the poor” there was barely a murmur.

      The majority of guardian commentary articles use sweeping collectives like those above in a negative damning context – and a fair number of those journalists will have Labour leanings or be party members. I imagine Rod could find a sizeable number of them, perhaps even written by Owen Jones himself, to take to his ‘meeting’ and pose the question of why there should be such double standards?

    • SunnyD

      even better (from that link) is the reply to “Saul O” from ex-Muslim: “Liddle was right. But his problem is that he is a white middle class person.”

    • Mr Grumpy

      And your views on the decision not to suspend Afzal Khan?

    • End of Days

      Doesn’t the Koran advocate the subjugation of all other religions – which suspect includes Judaism?

    • Jack Cade

      What happened to the Jews of Mecca?

    • Allosaurus

      Ignorant rubbish.

      Anti-semitism, like hatred of Christianity, is an intrinsic part of islam. If you didn’t know that, your opinion is worthless.

  • splotchy

    I am not sure how my suspension could be seen as a neutral act. A neutral act, surely, would be to not suspend me. Suspending me, I reckon, is a partisan act.

    I expect the ‘neutral’ aspect to it will be that they are hanging onto your £13 per month. As a sign they still retain a little hope for you, you understand, and something they will expect you to take comfort from. You are thus, at least in part, helping to finance your kangaroo court.

  • NiceChappie

    That’s what happens when you have the temerity to actually point out the presence of that humongous elephant in the Labour party’s room.
    Clearly no one is yet prepared to explain the rise in anti-Semitism across many European countries of immigration in the past 10 years.

  • Adrian Harper

    Rod remember when you posted racist posts on a millwall fansite? You initially and pathetically claimed your email had been hacked. hilarious. By the way is the Spectator still edited by an MI6 stooge as in the Dominic Lawson days?

    • rodliddle

      yes, Adrian, you cretin. It’s edited by MI5, Rupert Murdoch, Cameron, the Knesset and Westlife. And that’s remotely not what I said, incidentally. So look forward to a lawyer’s letter.

      • FriendlyFire

        Rod do please make a secret recording of the session so you can later regale us word-for-word and they can’t say you were exaggerating.

  • Fatima Fatwa

    Too many home truths for the labour party, plus you insulted the Palestinians who are the holy grail saintly victims of the Left and Muslim World. Palestinians are oppressed by the evil jooo’s and nothing is worse than that. The fact that Arabs treat eachother far worse, kill eachother by the millions doesn’t compare to a Joo building a house and defending himself.

    • NiceChappie

      Extremist Muslims and Islamists butcher more of their kith and kin each month than Israel is even alleged to have killed since the occupation started.
      The hypocrisy of the Left is vomit inducing.

    • flappospammo

      You really either have no idea or are an utter cretin

    • flappospammo

      ” Joo building a house and defending himself” on other people’s land

      good luck with that 1

    • Son_of_Casandra

      Palestinians = baby seal.

  • It’s off to the Gulag for you I’m afraid. Offending Islam is a Communist’s worst nightmare.

  • Malcolm Knott

    For the £13 a month you are paying these people you could get a penis extension and a brass saucepan.

    • Nomad

      One is double good but WTF are the saucepans for?

      • Malcolm Knott

        Don’t ask me, but French companies are urging Rod to buy them so there must be something in it.

        • Nomad

          Aha, la marmite.

    • In2minds

      I’ve heard of the term ‘brass neck’ but reckon for that sort of money you could get a brass penis!

  • Jethro Asquith

    Just tell ’em to Foxtrot Oscar

  • DazEng

    Please make sure you secretly film this. Arm yourself with the facts and ram their “Islamophobe” BS down their Lentil soup slurping throats.

  • boomslang74

    You waste £13 per month on that scurvy crew?! I thought you were supposed to be intelligent, Rod.

  • Morris Traveller

    I’m amazed that you are still a member of a party which seems to be lurching from one bout of insanity to another almost daily.

    As a mate of mine said recently- “It’s not like I’ve suddenly become right-wing or anything. My views are pretty much the same as they were when I was a student in the early 80s, albeit these days I’m slightly more of a Conservative when it comes to money matters. But on social issues, I’m still the same tolerant and liberal-leaning person I was back then but it’s as though the Left has gone utterly barking mad and disappeared off the side of the road and now they shout all kind of mad bollocks at me from behind trees”.

    I know how he feels- how the Left can demonise the only democratic and tolerant nation in the festering hellhole that is the Middle East, portraying it as an apartheid state (it isn’t) and championing the Fascistic, homophobic, misogynistic and racist thugs who make up Hamas and Hezbollah is beyond me. It is stupidity on such a monumental scale it’s difficult to know where to begin. It also appears to have escaped the notice of the Palestinian-obsessed nutters that, should their poster boys get their way and Israel were to disappear, there would be a ten-minute break for tea and oranges at half-time and then they would start slaughtering each other. Because those Sunnis and Shias in those two groups hate each other just as much as they hate the Jews, because they are Fascistic, homophobic, misogynistic and racist thugs.

    • MikeF

      The left aren’t necessarily mad. Their actions make perfect sense if you accept that their intention is the destruction of democracy through the destruction of the political culture of free speech and empiricism without which voting is meaningless.

      • Vieuxceps2

        Aye ,and the destruction of marriage and the family, the furtherance of queerdom and latterly the abolition of gender.. Lefty failedi with the financial aspects of society as repeatedly, socialist economies collapsed so now it’s cultural marxism ,led by entryism in schools and universities. Even entertainment is a weapon, when did you last see a rightwing comedian on TV? We’re under sustained attack,especially with PC speech rampant everywhere. We must resist it, alof us.

        • MikeF

          Absolutely – we are in a fight for western civilisation. It is as fundamental as that and though there are people out there trying to attack us physically it is ultimately a culture war.

          • Cassandra

            But fight how? I suspect that commitment to the kind of democracy beloved of the 17th-century Parliamentarians is on its last legs.

            Postmodern criticism has deconstructed the idea that there could be such a thing as democracy, or an Enlightenment, out of existence.

            The young believe that anti-racism means never objecting to anything a brown-skinned person says or does, and indeed the very idea of debating someone they disagree with has them fleeing for their safe spaces.

            Global capitalism has had no opposition since the collapse of the former Communist states, and the EU is just another corporatocracy which is soon to have its own standing army.

          • Leon Wolfeson

            Yes, you’re fighting Western Civilization, as you claim your violent far right…

        • Leon Wolfeson

          You are using PC, not resisting it. As you whine about less bullying and less suicides…as you deny i.e. Germany, preferring failed Torynomics… as you whine that few people who can’t work well with others do well in entertainment.. as you blame the Marxism in your head for your opposition to education…

      • Leon Wolfeson

        So you think your goals, which you blame on the left, make sense. Hmm!

    • salt_peter

      “…portraying it as an apartheid state…”

      That’s because once SA collapsed, the leftie anti-apartheid pressure groups did not disband, but looked for another target. The USSR was too big (and they worshipped it, while it lasted) Mugabe was too black. But Israel was white enough and small enough ostensibly to be safely bullied.

      They just switched targets and employed the same rhetoric and tactics.

      We get the same thing happening over alcohol-bashing now that it’s no longer fun to bash smokers. I’ve even seen the term ‘passive drinking’ appear in the propaganda.

      • John Standley

        “They just switched targets and employed the same rhetoric and tactics.”

        Don’t forget “global warming”.

    • gs07aaa

      I’d give you more than one vote if I could!

      • Verk

        Me too! Spot bloody on that was.

    • TomHark

      Talking of stupidity on a monumental scale, the freedom loving, dynamically democratic Communist Chinese have recently become the Tory Party’s newest best friend. We trust and adore them to the point that we have given them control of our nuclear power infrastructure.

    • Leon Wolfeson

      Funny, he isn’t a Tory. As your friend pretends badly… as your friend admits he’s incompetent on fiscal issues…

      As you ignore the fact that “the Left” is not one view (unless you stand with Brevik…), that’s PC… as you mention the Hamas who some among the far right support… as you blame Muslims for your views…

      (And ignore the difference between Arabs and Muslims, why Arab Nationalism rose…)

      • Morris Traveller

        “…it’s as though the Left has gone utterly barking mad and disappeared off the side of the road and now they shout all kind of mad bollocks at me from behind trees”.

        Thank you for proving my point for me.

        • Leon Wolfeson

          No, I don’t prove your hate for anything but hate… as you defend incompetence
          And as you stand with Brevik, in your PC thought crime beliefs.
          And then there’s your inability to differentiate between Arabs and Muslims, and your refusal to look at the history…

  • goodsoldier

    This is the kind of life we can expect from every corner if we stay in the EU.

    • Sargon the bone crusher

      The foul poison is in Labour Britian, not in Brussels. For now, anyway.

      • Vieuxceps2

        I oce thought lefties were goodhearted fools who meant well. Today’s crop are toxic fungi devoid of all humanity,fuelled by envy, hatred and ideology. Look at this Glass woman,not enough commonsense to recognise genuine concern in a voter, simply box-ticking him as “racist”and thus discardable. Do not support any of them.

        • Sargon the bone crusher

          They advertise the Grand Mufti’s ‘burn them’ alleged statement by talking about Hitlers period of conversation with him. Why?
          To advertise their ultimate antisemitism to their client muslim audience. Of couIt is that that Rod has highlighted by his truth about muslim attitudes to Israel and Jewery.
          SHAME on the disgusting and now – in many ways – repulsively racist and criminal Labour Party. A truly disgusting entity that should be proscribed.

  • It was interesting to read your story Rod. I found your notion about collective guilt of Muslims revolving as any racial profiling always is. yet I support your right to be a member of any party you wish, just as all other nutters are. Why not.

    Still, individual freedom of expression always comes into conflict with belonging to a collective. That was your moment. I love one citing in that respect, from a Russian poet Tzvetaeva – nobody digging though our letters ever figured out the extend of betrayal we are capable of when we are loyal to ourselves. Well. I am not a very good translator. Good luck.

    • In2minds

      “I found your notion about collective guilt of Muslims revolving as any racial profiling always is” –

      Revolving you say, now why is that?

      • It was revolting. I got dislecsia, letters mess up all the time and the spelling thinks it knows better for some reason.

    • Cassandra

      To repeat: Muslims are adherents of a particular, historical, patriarchal, Abrahamic religion characterised by the instruction to submit to Allah and make the rest of the world submit too.

      Race is defined by genetic characteristics, not by which belief system you choose to shape your life by.

  • salt_peter

    Why not just ignore them?

    And cancel the direct debit.

    • Erictheowl

      Absolutely. I mean, £13! Thirteen quid! A MONTH! you are being robbed blind, Rod

      • TomHark

        Good God man you could get yourself a second tv licence for that.

  • Sargon the bone crusher

    I have – as have very many others – great respect for Mr. Rod Liddle. His comments about Palestinians in Israel are so obviously true to those of us who have some familiarity with the Middle East.
    The Labour Party says, in as safe a legal way as it can, that it loathes Israel ( and obviously thus Jews, there is no way around that) and thus it presents itself to the burgeoning muslim bloc-votes for mass-support.
    The Labour Party has become, in so many profound ways, a really quite repulsive thing.I would like it to be proscribed and forbidden to have a place in the political life of the country.
    Good on you Rod.

  • COGNITIO

    It’s funny how criticising Jews is acceptable (expected) within the Labour party but criticising Muslims is apparently the worst sort of racism.

    • Vieuxceps2

      Well, there are lots of muslims, mostly unemployed who usually vote labour in a self-interested sort of way……

      • Leon Wolfeson

        Then there’s the other 99.99% of Labour voters…

    • TartanTerrier

      Criticise jews and nothing happens, does it. Try stating a fact about Germany in 1930’s and see what happens.

      • Oriental Imp

        A fact?

        • TartanTerrier

          Yes a fact. The Transfer Agreements between The Third Reich and the German Zionists are a fact.

          • Oriental Imp

            Sigh. I thought as much. There was I, giving you the benefit of the doubt, but no, you reach for your, no doubt well-stocked, cupboard of antisemitic crap.

            If you have any integrity or intellectual rigour read Mein Kampf. It’s all there, right from the beginning.

          • TartanTerrier

            And yet despite what is written in 1925 the Transfer Agreements facilitated letting the perceived ‘enemy’ go to Palestine in 1933 to 1939- 60,000 of them. Can this be denied as ‘facilitation’ or otherwise support for Zionism? According to Grand War Criminal Nettanyobbo Hitler didn’t want to kill jews he wanted to deport them….must be confusing the crap outta hasbara hacks like you……

    • Leon Wolfeson

      Funny, no, Labour moved on that…you’re projecting.

  • Viking.

    The Muslims hate the Jews, in fact they hate everyone. Telling the truth will get you shunned or jailed, but the truth is that Islam is a discriminating and murderous creed. Read the muslim holy texts and observe muslim behavior and this is clear, they are terrorists and proud to be so, and are promised great reward in paradise for killing infidels.

    • Fu-u, your hate speech stinks. I once was driving North circular and my radio picked up a guy who talked over his baby kid crying how Christians brought disaster to Arab world and should all be punished. That was stinky too, in a very similar way.

      • Adam Carter

        But is he wrong?
        If so, tell me where.

      • anonuk

        I know, the truth stinks. Far better to pretend it can’t be distinguished from stinking lies and prefer instead to believe the happy bunnies-and-rainbows lies we all pretend to subscribe to.

      • Anglian Reed

        “Hate Speech!”

        The persistent cry of petulant leftist babies, whenever they happen upon an opinion with which they disagree. Pathetic.

        • Leon Wolfeson

          Ah yes, those evil facts… as you sigh your post, Mr. Pathetic, with what you are.

    • Leon Wolfeson

      Blaming Muslims for your issues, check, as you spew PC. As you blame Muslims for your hostility…

  • Viking.

    Bukhari (004.052.177)

    ‘Narrated Abu Huraira: Allah’s Apostle said, “The Hour will not be established until you fight with the Jews, and the stone behind which a Jew will be hiding will say, “O Muslim! There is a Jew hiding behind me, so kill him.”

  • Viking.

    Factual truth is not subjective. Those that find the muslims innocent and victims, have either chosen to be ignorant or are devoid of understanding. Faced with the facts about the teachings of Mohammed and the atrocious behavior that this engenders in muslims no objective person can conclude other than that islam is evil, violent and discriminating, and is the cause of every one of the terrorist deeds that we witness daily. Everyone that calls themselves a muslim is guilty by association with this foul faith and ideology.

  • Perseus Slade

    e invidia unum
    (united in hate)
    the new Labour motto

  • Son_of_Casandra

    And Douglas Murray hits the nail right on the head again….

    https://youtu.be/USLEw4t9Wu0

  • Sean L

    Very masculine in appearance, Shami. That ear is extraordinarily man-like. The jaw and chin, a little less so. But why are you paying £13 a month to the Labour Party when what you write is opposed to everything they now stand for? Either you imagine that Jim Callaghan is still leader, with Roy Mason Secretary of State for Northern Ireland and Peter Shore at Trade and Industry etc. Or it’s just a tribal thing, like those people who vote Labour regardless. Or is it simply that it makes you more “interesting”…? Because your opinions on Islam and cultural enrichment generally, even where expressed in far more qualified terms than you typically use, are otherwise routinely described as “far right” in the media. Perhaps remaining in the Labour Party is a kind of balancing act, proof against any tarnishing of your “brand”…

    • Wessex Man

      Perhaps he was daft enough to believe Labour was a democratic British Party.

      • Sean L

        Yeah doubtless that was uppermost in his thought process…

    • MikeF

      Yes – the trick the Labour Party still pulls off though arguably with decreasing effectiveness is to pass itself off at elections as the party it was 40 years ago. Maybe that is because so many of its members are now far more overt in their contempt and hatred for the greater part of the population of this country – most obviously the ‘white working class’.

  • Richard Lutz

    Who is leading Labour’s investigation into racism and Naziphobia? No doubt there are some bad Nazis, just as there are some bad Christians and socialists, but it seems to me that we must protect moderate Nazis lest we drive them into the arms of the fanatics; which would naturally entail cracking down of the racist bigots who condemn all Nazis.

  • Maureen Fisher

    The star chamber will be intent on finding “Islamophobes” while Islamist and ultra leftists continue their entryist work.

    • Indeed…set up because of rampant antisemitism I see the inquiry will include Islamophobia…no guesses which will get most attention.

      • Maureen Fisher

        About as independent as the police managing their own enquiry. Shami will find and hunt down Islamophobes under the bed.

  • As so many others have said, what is there in the nature of the Labour party that Rod hath such need to be a part of it? I’m a working class boy and my grandparents were Labour party organisers in the 30s. I had a bit of time for Callaghan and Healey back in the day, but they could never outweigh the damage that the likes of the loathsome Roy Jenkins and the TUC did to the culture and the economy. On balance, Labour has been ruinous for the country. Attlee’s government saw the 1948 Nationality Act which opened the doors to mass immigration, in 1965 we had the first Race Relations Act and Jenkins policy of multiculturalism over the kind of assimilation that saw the (limited) Jewish migration of the 19th century become part of the British tribe. All the while we were paying ourselves more than we earned, borrowing from the future and failing to invest as we tried to maintain out of date industries and work practices. Finally we had Blair, who set the seal on the ruin of Labour’s post war governance and whom the left now laughably wishes to disown. Thanks to Labour there is precious little to save in Britain so I’m at a loss to know what there might be to save in the Labour party.

    They are being supported to the extent they are by a Muslim bloc vote and an apparent collapse in turnout by the white working class (the people we used to call ‘the British’). The figures for the Oldham byelection are extraordinary. Approximately 25% of the voters were Muslim, Turnout: 41%, max possible Muslim vote as a % of turnout: 62%, Labour vote share: 62%. Quite what will motivate the British element of the electorate to begin to turn out to vote in its own interest is anyone’s guess. They’ve abandoned Labour at last, but that’s only half the job. I had hoped Paul Nuttall & Patrick O’Flynn’s populist restyling of UKIP might energise the electorate (in a ‘Trump’ stylee) but little sign of it yet

  • AdrianM

    The problem is, London isn’t Britain. The greater population sees London as a multi-racial, multi-national, multi-millionaire, multi-difficult Citadel, and the Labour Party of today is a product of that kaleidoscopic crack-house of power politics and social strain. I spoke to a lady who lives in Hampshire yesterday and, in passing, she said that London scares her, and that she avoids going there. Corbyn’s multi-genus patch of grass-roots inhabits a distinctly scrubby urban backyard full of transient detritus, where flowers seldom grow.

    • Neil Saunders

      London is lost. Peter Hitchens is right when he says that it is a city-state which has effectively seceded from the rest of the UK, especially England (in which it is theoretically situated), and that the Mayor is actually its President. No truly English city could have been sundered from England in this way.

      • AdrianM

        I have to agree.

      • IainRMuir

        Bradford, Birmingham, Dewsbury, Oldham, Rotherham, Peterborough, Boston etc being quintessentially English?

        • Neil Saunders

          Of course not, Iain; they’re going (or, to be more exact, have already gone) in exactly the same disastrous direction.

      • Leon Wolfeson

        Yes, you’d never come near London, you might see a black person.

        No hate-filled pit from past era could have become London, right.
        Go home and stop attacking the capital of us Brits.

        • Neil Saunders

          I was born and bred in London, you idiot.

          • Leon Wolfeson

            London, Kentucky eh?

            Yea, very few black people there.

          • Neil Saunders

            No, Leon, London, England, as you know perfectly well.

          • Leon Wolfeson

            No, I am simply not a fool. I can read your posts, too, hence my view.

          • Neil Saunders

            Your view of what, Leon? That I come from a different city in a different continent? You’re just plain wrong. Admit it.

          • Leon Wolfeson

            No, I am not a liar like you.

          • Neil Saunders

            Can you prove that I have lied about being born and raised in London (England, in case their should be any possible confusion), Leon?

          • Leon Wolfeson

            Your posts exist. Your attempts at causing confusion…

          • Neil Saunders

            The only confusion is that existing in your mind, Leon.

          • Leon Wolfeson

            I’m sure, foreigner, you want to confuse British people like me.
            Your posts still exist.

          • Neil Saunders

            You’re as mad as a hatter, Leon.

          • Leon Wolfeson

            “UR MAD, BRIT”.

            Right.

          • Neil Saunders

            I was born in London, England; specifically, in Fulham, SW6, on 12th June 1960. This is a documented fact, not a lie.

          • Leon Wolfeson

            It’s a wild, unbelievable late claim from you. I have no reason to believe you, given your posting record and every reason to believe your earlier posts where you were clear you’re foreign.

          • Neil Saunders

            Go to the Public Record Office and check, then (you have my name and details). I’m only a foreigner outside the UK.

          • Leon Wolfeson

            The National Archives, as they are known, are not an identity verification service in the UK.

            Moreover, of course, I have no verification of your provided details.

    • Leon Wolfeson

      Ah yes, having more than one culture… as you blame not purging for strain. As you admit someone who’s afraid of Cities… as you talk about your plans for London…

      • AdrianM

        Wonderfully incoherent.

        • Leon Wolfeson

          I’m sure you are.

          As you work against Britain.

          • AdrianM

            If I knew what you are talking about, I might even agree.

          • Leon Wolfeson

            I’m just using English, right.

  • davejon

    Rod – join the only Party which dares to speak the truth – the BNP.

  • Cassandra

    Dear Rod – Thank you for being one of the few metropolitans who is willing to see and comment on the obvious. It seems the fact that something is true is no longer considered a good, or even sufficient, reason for saying it.

    My objections to Islam are ideological, not based on the fact that many Muslims have brown skin tones. I dislike the way a totalitarian ideology is normalising itself in this country, and I’m deeply ashamed that once again, Jews don’t feel safe in Europe. There are only 14 million of them world-wide: look at the number of Nobel Prize winners they’ve produced, quite apart from their European cultural legacy – Freud, Einstein, Chagall, Epstein, Mahler etc. What more do they have to do to win our admiration?

    I don’t support all of Israel’s policies, but given the amount of pressure that tiny country is constantly subjected to, I’m amazed that there’s a sane person left there – let alone that they never stop creating innovations in science, medicine, agriculture and computer technology. Why the Labour Party chooses instead to valorise the Palestinians, who are conspicuous only for being the largest recipients of aid and doing the least that is useful with it , is beyond me. When I’ve tried to talk to pro-Palestinians about the complexity of the issue, I’ve discovered that they don’t even know that Jordan was created at the same time as Israel in order to form a state for the Arabs. I despair.

    • right1_left1

      Many Jews are without doubt extremely clever. (proportionately more than many groups ?)
      Their nation has developed in a very short time frame and their cultural history is well established.
      Whether Jews are historically different from others originating in the Levant I rather doubt.
      Their literature tells them that they are.

      The problem is the establishment of Israel was flawed ( IMO anyway ) and it applies disproportionate ever increasing levels of violence and terror. to sustain itself.
      I see no solution but ongoing tragedy !

      Adding: as far as I can see neither Labour nor Tory have faced up to this.
      It is obvious to me that many Muslims will join the Labour party and will introduce anti semitism .
      A fact which confounds multi culti’s.
      When individuals mention such things they get a ‘call from Harry’.

      • Cassandra

        I share your pessimism.

        But what can one expect the remnants of the Jewish people to do but fight for their existence? The indigenous Jewish residents of the Mandate territory, the survivors of the Holocaust, the almost 1 million Jews who were ethnically cleansed from Arab countries in the same period Arabs fled Palestine, the stray colonies of African Jews, the 8000 who recently fled France, are all living on that tiny strip of land surrounded by a zillion hostile Arabs, who are taught day in, day out, to blame Jews for their political troubles, and religiously authorised to exterminate them.

        In the circumstances, I wouldn’t be meekly volunteering to walk singing into the gas chambers again, either, so I can’t blame Israel for existing. We have made Jews need a place to be, because they’re not safe with us, and their historic homeland is better than anywhere else. Seeing Jewish shop fronts being smashed in Paris during the pro-Palestine demonstrations was chilling – another Kristallnacht. That was before the kosher supermarket murders, but after the slayings in Marseille & Brussels. The chant of ‘Hamas, Hamas, Jews to the gas’ is utterly sickening, and people who congratulate themselves on being leftist should really think about who they’re choosing to stand with. Mr. Liddle is right to challenge the Labour Party.

        • right1_left1

          quote:’their (the jews and referring to Israel) historic homeland is better than anywhere else’
          This quote is inaccurate. In fact it is an expedient political lie unless of course you believe God really did talk to Abraham.

          The area currently designated Israel is not particularly a Jewish homeland.
          videoas exist showing Jews christians Muslims at least not killing one another and living in ostensible mutual tolerance.

          Arabs lived there way before Islam appeared on the horizon and were attacked and displaced by force.
          Joshua fought the battle of Jericho and all that.

          You would at least be being honest if you simply acknowledged that agression was used to take the land both from the Canaan (arab tribes) and during 1948/49 state declaration.

          sorry to post so much but it is hypocrical.
          on the 24 hour news today (20th May) two holocaust survivors were wheeled out byth BBC to sympahise with the needs of children refegees and contras with the Kinder Transport some from Holland during during WW”.
          All this at the same time tha Isreal is systemattically rejecting refugees crossing the sinai from N Africa.

          The arabs have suffered for the holocaust
          they did not implement it

          • mightymark

            In order to prove your claim that “the arabs have suffered for the holocaust” you would have to show that in no realistic circumstances other than those post 1945 including the holocaust would there have been a Jewish state in Mandate Palestine. I suspect neither you nor anyone else could do so. First there had already been the Balfour declaration, second there had also been various attempts at partition, and nearly a century of Zionist campaigning. All this in the context of an anti colonial/nationalist movement throughout the old European empires that sought self determination. Moreover we should not equate anti-Semitism solely with the unique mass murder of Jews constituted by the holocaust. That anti-Semitism more generally existed and was growing, not least in the Arab world, in the early part of the 20th C is undoubted creating and emphasising the need for a Jewish state.
            Israel might have been delayed but for the holocaust (actually I can see circumstances in which it might have come about earlier) but its coming was a virtual certainty – holocaust or no.

          • right1_left1

            A very weak ‘my side right or wrong ‘ response.
            To introduce an anti colonialist agenda into the debate is preposterous.
            In the area that has become known as Israel Jews were for at least 2000 years a numerical minority..
            That is a fact.

            Zionist campaigning was/is a major cause of the problem.
            The Balfour declaration lacks any validity except as the diktat of a colonialist mentality.

            The Arabs have suffered due to the understandable sympathy extended to Jews as a consequence of the holocaust.
            My totally ineffectual opposition rests on what I see as natural justice and the principle of self determination.
            Historical demographics should be paramount and ethnic cleansing should be absent.
            Arabs were ethnically cleansed.
            Jews set up violent terrorist groups to do it.

            The situation in the Middle East is insoluble due to religious zeal.
            The problem can be seen in India and may well escalate further in the UK.
            It is already fermenting into what may become a cauldron of violence and hate.
            As I see it the state of the UK economy will be a major determinant !

          • mightymark

            Not sure how you conclude its about “my side right or wrong” since I haven’t said anyone was right or wrong – merely given what I think is an objective appraisal of the history as it relates to he impact of the holocaust, though as It happens I am a Zionist – out and proud, so to speak!

            Having said that I genuinely don’t see that my argument could be seen as anti Palestinian or pro Israeli – in fact one could make out a such good case that wrong has been done to the Palestinians that needs putting right without mentioning the holocaust that one wonders why it is necessary to drag it in at all!

            You yourself give point to my rationale when you say:

            “Zionist campaigning was/is a major cause of the problem”

            and if we could agree a more neutral expression like “history” or “background” – since I don’t think it Israel as such is a “problem – there would be no disagreement between us on the point. However you need to accept that that campaigning goes back well before the holocaust – before even little Adolf was an unfortunate gleam in Pa Schicklegruber’s eye! Now, it might be stretching the point to argue as some do that such “campaigning” began with the traditional Jewish Passsover toast “next year in Jerusalem” (though small numbers over time did make that a reality such that by the 1840’s Jerusalem had a Jewish majority) however the growing feeling e.g. after the notorious “Damascus Case” – also in the 1840s – that Jews in the Ottoman Empire were getting a raw deal was also a spur and I need hardly add that Arab and Muslim anti Semitism worsened over time such that half of Israel’s present population consists of Jews from the Arab world.

          • right1_left1

            .I have to say that proclaiming to be a Zionist but not holding a pro Israel position is a contradiction equivalent to the claim that Islam is a religion of peace.

            What turned out to be effective Zionist campaigning began in earnest around 1880 when Jews were being persecuted in Russia.
            What is never mentioned is that Jews were complicit in the assassination of an alleged reforming Tsar Alexander.
            The subsequent Tsar, also Alexander then ‘cracked down’

            It always seems odd to me that the Jewish assassination of Tsar Nicholas never stirred up much long term hostility and I guess is never mentioned in the USA..
            I know communism is hated there so it would be bad poltics of the Jewish controlled foreign polcy makers to associate it’s development with collectivist Jewish viewpoints.

          • Ilya

            ‘the Jewish assassination of Tsar Nicholas’

            Narodnaya Volya was a multi-ethnic revolutionary socialist terrorist organization. It was led by the son of a serf and the aristocratic daughter of a former governor-general of St Petersburg.

            ‘Jewish controlled foreign polcy makers’
            Would you pretend to be offended if I called you an anti-Semite?

          • right1_left1

            Would I be offended if you called me an anti semite ?
            Not really, . the expression, just like Islamophobe, is worthless !

            I oppose Jihadism and authoritarian Islam.
            I oppose Zionism and the territorial conquest it has espoused.

            re assassinations you are mixed up.
            Naradnaya Volya was involved in the assassination of Tsar Alexander. 2nd.
            While relatively easy to find the names of the leaders whether they were Jewish or not is difficult.
            One who was is Gesia Gelfman

            If they were not then what reason did Alexander 3rd allow Jewish persecution. ?
            You say intrinsic anti semitism no doubt ?

            The assassination of the family of Tsar Nicholas 2nd was carried out by a secret police cell which was part of the Jewish led Bolshevik party.

            Least that info. is available on I suppose anti semitic websites ?

          • Ilya

            “Not really, . the expression, just like Islamophobe, is worthless !”
            The expression is actually taxonomically useful. It makes it very easy to predict what someone will say next since anti-semites regurgitate the same narrow set of myths and half-truths.

            “What is never mentioned is that Jews were complicit in the assassination of an alleged reforming Tsar Alexander.”
            Your ‘reasoning’ seems to be that Jews are collectively responsible for every negative (but not positive?) act committed by groups which include Jewish and non-Jewish individuals. Do you apply the same standards to non-Jews? Are the Serbs collectively responsible for Franz Ferdinand, WWI and II, the Russian Revolution, the Cold War, the Iranian coup, the Islamic Revolution etc?

            “Naradnaya Volya was involved in the assassination of Tsar Alexander. 2nd.
            While relatively easy to find the names of the leaders whether they were Jewish or not is difficult.”
            Right. Jewish until proven otherwise.

            “If they were not then what reason did Alexander 3rd allow Jewish persecution. ? You say intrinsic anti semitism no doubt ?”
            Shockingly, Russia does have a bit of a history with anti-semitism. That and scapegoating were probably at the roots of Alexander’s motives.

            “Jewish led Bolshevik party”
            Curious then that the Bolsheviks suppressed Judaism, that Trotsky lost to a Georgian, and that the Soviet Union became the world’s leading supporter of anti-Zionism.

          • right1_left1

            You raise some valid arguments.
            My basic point was to show that if an authoritarian regime is violently challenged it will respond with violence. (bear in mind by Russian standards Alexander 2nd was considered a reformer)

            The narrative re the pogroms in Russia in the late 19th century never mentions any triggering mechanism. ie the assassination.
            Re anti semitism of Russia: we entered WW2 allegedly to defend one of the most anti semitic nations in Europe…aka Poland !
            One thing the Polish did was to try to limit Kosher slaughter.
            So they weren’t all bad were they ?

          • Ilya

            “if an authoritarian regime is violently challenged it will respond with violence.”
            Correct. But the vast majority of Russian Jews had nothing to do with the Narodniki and didn’t deserve the ‘response’. You also can’t underestimate the importance of scapegoating as an authoritarian self-preservation tool. For more recent examples, see the Muslim world’s obsession with Zionists.
            “The narrative re the pogroms in Russia in the late 19th century never mentions any triggering mechanism. ie the assassination.”
            That’s news to me. Wikipedia and Britannica do.
            ‘The first extensive pogroms followed the assassination of Tsar Alexander II in 1881. Although the assassin was not a Jew, and only one Jew was associated with him, false rumours aroused Russian mobs in more than 200 cities and towns to attack Jews and destroy their property.’
            http://www.britannica.com/topic/pogrom
            “Re anti semitism of Russia: we entered WW2 allegedly to defend one of the most anti semitic nations in Europe…aka Poland !”
            I’m sorry, I don’t understand what you’re getting at here.

          • right1_left1

            Re the ‘narrative’ and the Russian pograms: I meant the popularly available politics that simply mentions the Jewish pograms/emigration but never elaborates on any possible cause.

            A similar example would be the attack on Pearl Harbor and the fact that the USA had imposed an oil embargo on Japan.
            Likewise recent destabilisation of the Ukraine sanctions on Russia and consequences eg take over of Crimea.

            Re your point that the majority of Jews were not responsible for the assassination: i cant disagree.

            You should say the same about rockets fired into Israel and the Muslim population.tho’ my guess is that due to hatred felt by the Arabs many do support those rockets.

          • Cassandra

            The Jews were a minority in historical Israel in the 20th century. ( Statistics were not well or systematically kept before that. What we do know from the record of the Caliphates governed from Damascus and Istanbul is that they had no interest in Jerusalem or indeed Palestine as a whole.)

            However, there were millions of Jews in other Middle Eastern regions. At the time of the Nakba, almost a million were expelled from the Muslim Arab-dominated states of the region, and, fortunate to escape with their lives, but forced to leave their property behind, they moved to the new State of Israel. No compensation for that has ever been paid. No Arab country is offering the right of return to them. You also fail to acknowledge that many Jews bought their land legally from absentee Ottoman landlords, and that many “Palestinian” Arabs also immigrated in the early 20th century, when the Jews began to make something of the country.

          • right1_left1

            Estimates are available over quite a long time period for the demographics of what has become Israel. The Ottomans did keep recordsAt all times the Jews were a minority.

            Disruptive population movements did occur as violence escalated during the early 20th century due to Arab natural objections to Jews entering from Russia.
            The majority leaving Russia went to America,

            If you admit that Jews were a minority in the 20th century , which they were and you do, then what basis exists to declare an independant state ?

          • Cassandra

            Why is it disingenuous to point out that as Arabs fled the new State of Israel, as instructed by invading Arab armies, a commensurate number of Jews were driven out of Arab countries? If a Yemeni was supposed to make a new life in Israel, why shouldn’t a Palestinian make a new life in Jordan? The population exchange required to ethnically cleanse the new state of Pakistan of Hindus was much bloodier.

            Jews were forced by conquest to become a minority in a country they had founded, built and sustained for centuries, in just the same way as the Chinese import themselves into Tibet, or Saddam moved Arabs into Kurdish territory. That doesn’t mean the minoritised indigenous populations have no moral or political right to reclaim conquered land if they can.

          • right1_left1

            The Arabs were expelled by force from the area where the Jews congregated and planned to create a state .
            This cannot possibly be denied.
            Film is available of them leaving !

            My unshakeable conviction is that the Levant was never a Jewish domain.
            Jews lived there that is true. So did Arabs.
            Since agreement between the religiously driven populations was impossible force was applied.
            Consequence? Ongoing conflict slowly spreading across the world .

            The distinction between an Arab and a Jew is not genetic.
            It cannot possibly be.It is cultural.

          • Cassandra

            As I have said from the beginning, this is a cultural issue – specifically here, an ideological struggle. It becomes political when Muslims claim that any land they once conquered – and that applies to streets in northern towns as much as to Israel – is theirs forever.

            A few years ago, I was only permitted to go and look at my old primary school because a “community elder” restrained the gang of Muslim adolescents demanding to know what I was doing in ” their ” street, & he told me that I should make my visit very brief, or else…

          • Cassandra

            The identification of modern Palestinians with ancient Canaanites is not accepted by academic historians and archaeologists. It’s a recent, politically-motivated claim. In contrast, archaeological finds dating back thousands of years affirm the connection of Hebrew-.speaking people with the area. The Al Aqsa mosque is built on top of the Jewish temple. Israel is mentioned in the Qur’an as the perpetual home of the Jews according to the will of Allah.

          • right1_left1

            Fairy tales aka religious texts, assert that the Hebrews were told to use force to take the land known as Canaan.
            A whole swathe of Jewish apologetics exists trying to rationalise that message
            adding: and in fact many other messages involving slaughter sacrifice and plagues !!!
            The fancy word is theodicy

            The fact is that the Levant , which covers a lot of territory is an area of semitic antecedant population where Jewish interests had no special right to ownership.
            The right was implemented by militant political activism

          • Cassandra

            Indeed. But other countries which invented themselves by right of conquest – many ancient inhabitants of the Levant were from what is now Greece, Turkey, Iraq – especially when they did it back in the Bronze Age – are permitted to go on existing. It seems it’s only Israel we have a problem with.

          • right1_left1

            You have revealed the flaw in your POV
            Other nations that created themselves by force did so mostly some time ago , the USA , or a modus ‘accept the status quo’ ( not sure what is the correct terminolgy )was established
            India Pakistan Bangladesh being a good example.

            No doubt you might quote exceptions to the above but those nations will not be so important geo politically.
            The Israel Arab tragedy is ‘on going’ and has enormous geo political consequences.

            Israel is clearly aiming for a modus accept the statu quo solution.
            Very long term Islamic violent divisions indicate that it is not obtainable.

          • Cassandra

            If there’s a flaw in my POV, you haven’t identified it. We were discussing ancient times. You introduced the topic by referring to Biblical Canaan, remember?

            It is in that context that I noted a) that ancient Israel established itself b) as did many other kingdoms, some of which were set up in the Levant by people from what is now Greece, Turkey and Iraq.

            If you would now like to discuss contemporary Israel, fine. Your post suggests it established itself. It did not. It went through the appropriate process to be recognised in international law, as did the equally new Muslim States such as the Hashemite Kingdom of Jordan – which in response to Arab complaints, received most of the land originally awarded to Israel – and the Islamic State of Pakistan. All three were legally acknowledged at roughly the same time.

          • Leon Wolfeson

            Really? Which Palestinian Arab leader was very influential in shaping his thinking on the “Jewish Question”.

            The Grand Mufti of Jerusalem, in fact.

          • TartanTerrier

            I think Hitler had pretty much made up his mind by 1939…….

          • Leon Wolfeson

            So you not only don’t think, you don’t have any idea about what happened.

          • TartanTerrier

            Mein Kampf pretty much set out his views on race…….that was in 1925.

          • Leon Wolfeson

            But the policy on Jews…changed several times. It wasn’t until the Wannsee Conference in 1942 that the “Final Solution” became official policy.

      • Leon Wolfeson

        Ah, the “fact” about your opposition to Multiculturalism – and hence allowing i.e. Jews and Sikhs in Britain, at all!

        Why do you want Muslims to front in Labour for you?

        • right1_left1

          I bitterly regret the mass immigration that has occurred in the UK
          My base date is the 1950’s
          I leave for you to consider which groups have entered the UK en masse since then !

          I am not an ideologically committed political party supporter.
          I was mentally conditioned by living in an area that has never elected other than Labour MP’s.
          The rise of political influence of Islam is ominous.

          My unexpressed opinions may well be considered as hate crimes so will have to remain unexpressed.
          Oddly as those who suppress hate crime ‘steamroller on’ hate seems to increase.

          • Leon Wolfeson

            Ah, so you’re against i.e. the Jews from…right.

            And I get the Parties are too leftist for you… as you blame Labour for your view, and mention another target. As you stop short of criminal actions but admit you’d do them if you could… as you try and make excuses for criminals and their choice to blame people for simply being different.

        • Cassandra

          Cultural practices are not the same thing as ethnic heritage. It’s perfectly possible to be happy to live with people from all over the world, and still wish to resist the imposition of a totalitarian conformism allegedly dictated for the whole of humanity some 1400 years ago.

          • Leon Wolfeson

            Indeed, and yet you are fine with more recent totalitarian conformists, it seems.

            As you ignore the fact that i.e. the Spanish Inquisition’s issues with Conversos was precisely because people don’t abandon their deep-held beliefs. You get surface conformity, and deep-held issues.

            Same way Stalin, for that matter, failed to eliminate difference among the peoples the USSR ruled.

    • TomHark

      Counting Nobel prizewinners seems to be hinting at a kind of racial superiority.

      • Cassandra

        I wasn’t hinting at anything. I was plainly stating a fact.

        If you’d like me to interpret it, I’d say that the respective sets of cultural priorities, not race, are the significant factor. Jews appear to believe that the world is there to be explored, improved, and healed. That ideal isn’t always reflected in the political actions of the State of Israel, as many Israeli Jews have noted, but it is a small, besieged country and the people there have nowhere left to run to. I imagine 60 years of that sort of stress might well promote a certain desperation.

        The current generation of media-promoted Muslims appear to wish to export the attitudes of 7th-century Arabia to the entire world. How many articles do we see solemnly explaining the halal ritual and how many celebrating the Syrian Kurds’ bold venture into secular local cooperatives? There are many Muslim dissenters speaking against regressive attitudes in the Arab countries and in the Indian sub- continent – in fact with regard to Jews, they say what Mr. Liddle says – but they are harassed, jailed and assassinated, while in the West, we refuse to support reformers because we seem to believe the Wahhabis or Deobandis are more authentic.

        • TomHark

          On a per capita basis Israel ranks twelfth in numbers of prizewinners. Even allowing for the fact that the state has not been in existence as long as the Nobel prizes have, I see nothing particularly noteworthy to set Jews apart.

          • Cassandra

            My comment about cultural contributions, including Nobel prizes, refers to Jews, not Israelis, as anyone who troubles to read it can see.

          • TomHark

            Which is why I infer that you are implying a kind of racial superiority.

          • Adam Carter

            Are they racially superior?
            I don’t know.
            But if they are why would it be wrong to say so?
            Only a fool believes that people are equal in ability.
            How many white men have won medals in the 100m on the Olympic track? Not many.
            How many black men have won medals in the 100m in the Olympic pool?
            People are not equal in ability.
            But they are equal in rights.

            If Jews are intellectually superior to Arabs it might be worth a study to find out if that is because they haven’t been marrying their cousins to the same extent.
            But that study would only be worthwhile if the answer is unknown.
            Being afraid of what the answer might be would not be a good reason to prevent such a study.

          • TomHark

            I don’t know either nor have I suggested that it would be wrong to say so.
            If it can be established that Jews are intellectually superior to Arabs it would certainly be of interest to find out why. However I would argue that intellectual superiority is not the same thing as racial superiority.

          • They (and we. and most of Asia) are clearly culturally superior to both Arabs and blacks. Whether there is a genetic aspect to it is questionable as culturally assimilated blacks and Arabs (as opposed to those living under their own cultures in the West) seem to function as well as we do

          • Duke Amir Often

            In what way are you culturally superior to Arabs or blacks, please? What do you know of culture? Coronation Street?

          • The fact that economic refugees only seem to head one way, the fact that there aren’t many stable, prosperous and functioning black or Arab civil societies… the fact that (rather amusingly) there are more new books published per annum in Belarus than in North Africa and the Middle East (outside of the great state of Israel) combined.

            http://chartsbin.com/view/30695

          • Leon Wolfeson

            So you ignore the history of capitalism… etc.

            And then you use one type of retail counting of books… (Tip – western biased and not useful for comparisons outside the west)

          • Cassandra

            Do you have evidence s/he didn’t use the stats collected by As-Sharq al Awsat in 2013, or the extensive report presented at the Frankfurt Buchmesse by an Arab, or the material put out by the Lebanese bookseller at the Beirut fair, whose stall featured a tombstone representing Arab publishing of anything but the Qur’an?

          • Leon Wolfeson

            Oh, so no stats but three anecdotes from you…right.

            I mentioned the things which disproved you, yes.

          • TomHark

            You’ll have to explain this ‘cultural superiority’, I haven’t a clue what it means.

          • That’s your loss then I guess

          • TomHark

            Is that you demonstrating your cultural superiority over me (and 4 billion other human beings)? Bet you’re a whizz at chess when you’re not pioneering nanotechnology.

          • No it’s me telling you what you can do with your disingenuous drivel, old sport. The lessons are all over the world. My interpretation is the generous one, if anything

          • TomHark

            Good news Nicetime! Your proctologist tells me she has found your head.

          • And that would appear to be the highest logic of which you are capable. Well done for thinking you could join in

          • anonuk

            If you go far back enough, everyone was marrying their cousins (or having relations with them) on a fairly consistent basis for most of human history.

          • Cassandra

            Orthodox Jews do sometimes marry their cousins. But they strongly tend to have genetic testing first. In Bradford, a high proportion of children born to parents of Pakistani ethnicity suffer autosomal recessive disorders, because genetic testing wasn’t ordered by the Qur’an. If you’ve ever seen children with epidermolysis bullosa, you will understand the cruelty and horror of this stupidity. The MP for Keighley, Ann Cryer, tried to raise awareness about this, but predictably, was accused of Islamophobia.

          • Leon Wolfeson

            So your knowledge of statistics, and lack of understanding that certain diseases run in communities..

          • Cassandra

            Could you not quite manage a whole sentence?

          • Leon Wolfeson

            Can you use one word without hate?

          • Cassandra

            Autosomal recessive disorders ” run in communities” because of in-breeding. Anyone with any decency would test for compatibility with the numerous potential cousin- brides to ensure the safety of their future offspring. Instead, it’s “Insh’Allah” and the NHS will take care of the suffering children.

          • Leon Wolfeson

            Except genetics is not that simple, as you admit you’re against testing, right.
            As you talk about your views.

            Back in reality, your ignorance of many of the conditions and why they’re more common among certain communities remains.

          • Cassandra

            Please stop clicking the Reply button when you only wish to talk to yourself, repetitively. I already explained that it was a matter of cultural priorities, NOT RACE. And I did not claim that either Jews or Israelis were exceptional. I pointed out that they had been very useful members of the human race if we measure by what they have contributed to learning, humanities, the arts, etc.

            The last time the Arabs contributed anything was shortly after they’d invaded countries in which they found Jews and Christians to translate Greek texts into Arabic. The process was repeated when they gained access to the scholarship of India, which had the concept of zero before any other culture.

          • TomHark

            So nice of you to point out how one particular group of humans had been very useful members of the human race.

          • Cassandra

            When a group of people is uniquely singled out for persecution, it seems to me in accordance with the principle of justice that one should ask why that is. Have the Jews oppressed the human race more than they’ve given it? In my view, no.

          • anonuk

            How many countries are there with modern education systems? 100? 150? 12th is pretty good going.

          • TomHark

            Absolutely agree. I even pointed out that Israel hasn’t had as much time as other countries to accrue them. However, my concern was with Cassandra’s claim of exceptionalism for Jews.

          • Cassandra didn’t mention Israeli Nobel prize winners.

      • anonuk

        Do you deny that Jews tend (on the whole) to be highly intelligent?

        • TomHark

          Deny : state that one refuses to admit the truth or existence of.
          Interesting that you ask me if I deny something which might not necessarily be true.

          • anonuk

            I suppose you could say that their intelligence is shown through “book” learning and being able to build upon that. This has existed for thousands of years, since it became a general expectation that all men of the Jewish faith should read and write biblical texts and exposition in Hebrew.

            This doesn’t explain why the Greeks, who did more than anyone else, including the ancient Hebrews, to invent philosophy, science, etc., have less prowess in this area than they did back in the day. Once, a truly learned Jew was Hellenized, schooled in the learning of the Greeks over the conventional religious learning of his own people and time. Now, they are Americanized.

      • MikeF

        It’s better than counting bodies.

        • TomHark

          I can’t quite follow your line of thought.

      • yeoman

        By and large Jews prize education more than many.

        • TomHark

          more than many what? More than many, what more than your parents, my parents. Even a sturdy yeoman tells us that, what does he tell us?, O yes there is something mystical about them.

        • TomHark

          Speak for yourself sturdy yeoman, I and my ilk have long prized education and fought for its availability for all.

      • CheshireRed

        Oh God…

    • Adam Carter

      Perhaps we could admire them more if they were to loudly, publicly and repeatedly renounce their religion’s absurd claim that they are, in any way, God’s chosen people.

      • anonuk

        Is that before or after the Archbishop of Canterbury or the Pope renounce the words of Jesus, “I am the Way the Truth and the Life, no-one comes to the Lord except through me”? Followed by a number of “top” imams renouncing their belief in the prophet-hood of Mohammed.

        Such a step would surely make a mockery of the religion, wouldn’t it?

        • Yes but Adam doesn’t care about that: he just hates Jews…as they all do except it takes a while for them to realise.

    • mightymark

      Interestingly there was precious little reference to the Palestinians in the shenanagins of a few weeks ago. Livingstone’s “Hitler” idiocies at the time were totally Palestinian free. The left’s objective in aiming to destroy Israel is basically anti Western and the Palestinians are bit players to be wheeled on and off at will. The Jews – well – just on the wrong side of “history”.
      Domestically too their choices are about power politics – and race equality, discrimination, prejudice etc can go hang.

      • Leon Wolfeson

        Funny, the left don’t have that goal at all. A few far leftists do, but unless you want to be blamed for Brevik…

        As you ignore the fact Corbyn isn’t a Blairite.

        • mightymark

          OK – not all the left, but a considerable part of it – and I’d include Corbyn there along with the little Corbynites too. If you think I am wrong can you explain the emphasis, to the point of obsession, on “Zionism” which is almost academic in criticising the current Israeli government’s policies and arguably even gets in the way of doing so?Look at the knots Livingstone has tied himself in! I know of no other case in which a supposedly anti-oppression/anti colonialist/pro human rights etc etc movement has obsessed so much about the ideological origins of the alleged “oppressor”.
          I’ll put my neck out and say it is because their prime aim is to demonise, delegitimise Israel (thee being as much as they can do given they don’t have an army themselves) with a view to the ultimate destruction of the State of Israel – not help the Palestinians.
          No other answer makes sense.

          • Leon Wolfeson

            Ah, you’ll keep up the PC bigotry and exclude who, the Blairites? Livingstone, right, never mind what’s happened to him…

            As you deny the rhetoric routinely put out by lots of groups on the right, and as you ignore the fact plenty on the far right… as you say people evidently must share your views…

          • mightymark

            Well, the left I’m talking about goes wider than than Labour Party and Livingstone was expelled only for particularly objectionable phrasing.

            As for the rest I honestly have no idea what your second paragraph is about and you do not appear able/willing to engage with my overall point.

          • Leon Wolfeson

            Ah, so your PC goes wider… as you ignore what’s going on.

            As you note I don’t agree with your PC bigotry, and your denial of the hate routinely shown by elements of the far right is sad.

          • mightymark

            I take it “PC” here stands for “political correctness” – which accusation generally implies some kind of bad faith. OK (and I genuinely hope you can help me here) if what I say is wrong and in “bad faith” then first, where do I find a part of the left that is positive about Zionism (outside of groups like Labour Friends of Israel and the Jewish Socialist group?) and second how do you explain the obsession of others on the left with “Zionism” when what is claimed is “justifable criticism of Israel’s policies”?

            I hope the English is good enough for you to engage on matters of substance as I am genuinely interested to know your views.

          • Leon Wolfeson

            “the English is good enough”.

            Sigh.

            And Jews like me on the left, well!
            The conspiracy you’re trying to push over the far left is sad, PC man.

            And yes, you’re using bad faith and worse being a collectivist.
            (Which..I’m not. I don’t *like* collectivism, my strand of the left is individualist, but details)

          • mightymark

            I think the fact that you can come up with reply like that shows the poverty of your case (whatever that may be – because I’m still not wholly certain). Goodnight and good shabbas.

          • mightymark

            Since you have now changed the “reply” you clearly agreed with me about the “poverty” the original. So that is some, but far from enough progress! And the validity and fact of individualism doesn’t invalidate collective judgement if enough individuals share a common thought – which in this case, and in my judgement they do. And I note again that you clearly cannot engage with the substantive point of my posts. If I am pushing a “conspiracy” (actually I think its all but open) then debunk it.

          • Maureen Fisher

            Most of what he writes is incomprehensible. I wouldn’t bother trying to unravel it if I were you.

          • Leon Wolfeson

            So you think the facts mean you want to put me into poverty…as you admit you don’t read my posts…

          • mightymark

            I think l have made abundantly clear that I have put, if anything, too much effort into reading your posts, and far more than they probably deserve.

          • Leon Wolfeson

            Yes, you can’t stand other views, check. And don’t read other people’s posts based on your bigotry and clearly an apparent dislike of discussion. Oh well.

    • Leon Wolfeson

      So you don’t know much about Islam. As you ignore the fact *radical* Islam is hardly the only issue facing Jews today, especially in Britain.

      Your ignorance of the Labour Party’s stance is sad.

      And say, why won’t Jordan take the West Bank back?

    • Anglian Reed

      “It seems the fact that something is true is no longer considered a good, or even sufficient, reason for saying it.”

      Consider the trial of Geert Wilders in the Netherlands for ‘Hate Speech’ or some other nonsense offence, at which it was effectively declared that ‘the truth is no defense’.

      Regardless of whether what one says is true, if it is found to be ‘hateful’ or ‘offensive’ – which are entirely subjective considerations – you may indeed be found guilty of speaking the truth.

      What a bizarre, and terrible, situation.

    • Maureen Fisher

      I think you’ll find you can’t talk to Pro Palestinians as they usually scream insults at anyone who doesn’t agree with them.

  • John Brexiteer

    But why even entertain such a star chamber, just laugh at them, take the mick, mock them, take away their self appointed perceived authority, they won’t like that, simply do not give them the gravitas of which they seek. This would confound them more and have them bed wetting, throwing their teddies about, sulkily stomping about the place with their pink slippers on with London awash by their wailing wahs, as they demand to be taking seriously and demand that you respect their ‘authoritah’.

    • FriendlyFire

      Never fear, I have a feeling Rod will do something very akin to what you suggest.

      • John Brexiteer

        I realised that after I posted, I easily forget these things some times, especially when jumped up Stasi bullying types start throwing their weight about.

      • Leon Wolfeson

        He’s already shown he’s not a Labour supporter, and hence was not in the right in the first place when he joined so…

        • FriendlyFire

          Yes, I agree that Rod is too insightful, pragmatic and honest to be a member of Labour.

          • Leon Wolfeson

            Oh, so you think being that sort of infiltrator…k.

    • Leon Wolfeson

      So in fact justify what was said? Sure. As you blame people for your issues.

      As you try and mock an investigation into…

  • Bill Kendall

    Shami Chakrabarti seems to me a strange person to run an inquiry into antisemitism, not sure if she is a Muslim herself, her parents were Hindu, but I get the feeling she may be prejudiced against Jews?

    • MikeF

      The strange thing is that long-standing members of the Labour Party like Rod should be subject to an inquisition by someone who only joined the part a week or two back. But the Labour Party can do what it likes. My only concern is that it is destroyed.

      • whs1954

        Another strange thing is that an inquiry that was meant to be into the vicious anti-semitism now infecting swathes of the Labour Party has made its first expellee someone who has been calling out the vicious anti-semitism now infecting swathes of the Labour Party. Within almost days of being appointed, Chakrabarti has turned this round into just another Islamophobia-hunt.

        • MikeF

          What’s the betting she will be a Labour candidate at the next General Election. Though, of course, if her background is Hindu you can bet it won’t be in a constituency with a significant Muslim vote.

        • Leon Wolfeson

          Except for the facts about this, but hey.

      • Leon Wolfeson

        Yes, of course, only the One True Party (the Party of God) must be allowed to exist after all.

        • TartanTerrier

          Thats jews isn’t it Gods Chosen……

          • Leon Wolfeson

            Chosen as in “congratulations you’re chosen”, with extra duties.

            But hey, a. bigotry more, b. thanks for noting it’s not actually Zionists or Israelis you’re after.

          • TartanTerrier

            Only loonies like you write in terms of the One True Party….echoes of Germany 90 years ago……

          • Leon Wolfeson

            So you blame me for your issues, as you talk about your favored time.

            And as you decry mockery, Fash. No humour allowed near your po-faced…
            As you defend the same old Jewhate.

      • TartanTerrier

        Keep wishing…..!

    • Faulkner Orkney

      I’d focus more on the fact that she’s an idiot.

    • Shorne

      A quote from a ‘Jewish Chronicle’ interview “Ms Chakrabarti, who grew up in north-west London as the daughter of immigrants from Calcutta, said her parents’ Jewish friends had been a key influence on her during her youth.”
      Joining the Labour Party at this stage was ill-advised however.

  • Marvin

    This comes about from the ideology and thinking, that because my father and grand father and everyone else in my family have always voted Labour, so I must regardless of their asinine and ignorant policies. So Rod, you have your own naïve self to blame.

  • Hippograd

    Antisemitism and other vile, repulsive and utterly unacceptable thought-crimes are also rife among members of the Millwall-supporting community. Until the Board of the Deputies finds out and pays a visit. “Nice career you’ve got there, Rodders. Shame if somefink were to happen to it.”

  • scampy

    If only the lib/lab luvvies could point us to just one successful civilized African country run by blacks/muslims in the last 2000 years?

    • TomHark

      Civilized as exemplified by 20th Century Europe and Russia?
      btw was it not with the Tories with whom the libs had their most recent luvvie relationship?

    • Leon Wolfeson

      What a surprise, that excuse for…

  • jmjm208

    How do you know your monthly sub. isn’t being used to fund ISIS?

    • Wedgie Benn

      It’s against the law to give to an organization ‘you ‘ believe funds terrorism, if expelled I’d ask for last months money back

  • Ingmar Blessing

    Is it possible to get a live stream from the court?

  • Scribbling Scribe

    Oddly, as far as I know, most anti-Semites who have been suspended by the
    Labour party were reinstated a few days later. Eg the intellectual colossus
    Beinazir Lasharie who ‘knows’ that Jews are behind 9/11 and ISIS. So it
    would appear you get banned from the labour party for pointing out the
    anti-Semitism, particularly amongst Muslims, but reinstated if you are
    actually anti-Semitic.

    • Mc

      That’s the point of Soviet show trials: it’s a charadic mechanism to absolve the favored and to discard the party “enemies”

    • Leon Wolfeson

      So you don’t follow what actually happened…

  • Adrian Morgan

    Brilliant post, particularly with your description of Owen Jones!

    If you have been suspended, after four weeks you should be entitled to a refund of your membership fee… unless Shami and Harry have decided to follow the guidelines for inquisition from Sprenger and Kramer’s ‘Malleus Maleficarum’, where the accused must pay for the process of being interrogated. Hopefully Shami won’t, as recommended by Sprenger and Kramer, be employing torture as part of the interrogation (though you could possibly – at a stretch – find that “stimulating.”)

  • TomHark

    What was it that Marx (Groucho, so calm down Rod) said about belonging to a club that had Liddle as a member?

  • William Matthews

    Mr Liddle, it’s hard not to imagine, your card not being marked the day the blessed beard rose to prominence. If there is one thing that Labour cannot, and will not tolerate, is half an ounce of common sense, or any pragmatism, irrespective of how small that maybe. I also find it slightly astonishing, that the Labour Party turning their anti-Semitism inquiry, into a Witch Hunt (another) to purge their party of undesirables, like you, comes as a surprise.

    • MikeF

      True they find commonsense difficult but it is mockery they really cannot stand

    • Leon Wolfeson

      “common sense, or any pragmatism”

      You’re talking about Rod Liddle. So…what?
      As you ignore the fact that, as seen in this article, he’s not a Labour supporter.

  • Chris Bartelt

    Since when has quoting Mel Brooks not been allowed?

  • NickG

    a smirking OGPU thug loaded the bullets into a pistol

    It’s little sad how British grown men are now almost universally completely ignorant about firearms.

    Being something of a ballistic pedant, after having spluttered over my port somwhat, I feel the need to interject. Bullets are the bit that leaves the barrel, flies through the air and does the damage. Rod means ‘cartridge’ which is the entity made up of a brass case containing powder topped off by the bullet and tailed with a primer..

    That is unless Rod has in mind mid 19th century cap-and-ball revolvers, earlier single-shot flintlocks, wheel-locks, matchlocks or the like, one loads cartridges into a pistol, NOT bullets. Bullets are the bit that comes out the barrel, flies through the air and does the damage.

    Well actually one typically loads cartridges into the cylinder of a revolver. In modern parlance a pistol is usually taken to mean a semi-automatic handgun – one loads them into a magazine before loading that into the pistol.

    With a modern handgun, be it a revolver or a semi-automatic pistol, one loads ‘the bullets’ into the cartridge only if one ‘home brews’ or reloads one’s own ammunition – makes up ones own cartridge – from constituent components. That is to say case, primer, powder and bullet, using a reloading press.

    For the sad gits amongst you – the amiable Hickock45 demonstrates an 1858 Remington cap and ball revolver, including loading ‘the bullets’ into it – here.

    • Chris Bartelt

      Ha! Excellent. A veritable pedantosaurus! I was niggling to myself about exactly the same. And Hickock45 is great isn’t he, kind of like the Grandpa you never had.

      • NickG

        Hickock45 is a gem. He is more fun than Gardeners Question Time, more informative than the Today program and more thrilling than The Archers and EastEnders combined!

        For those interested in history – the British military musket, 1722 through to the 1750s or so, was ‘Brown Bess’. This covered the period of the American revolution, the Napolionic wars and the subjugation of India. Hickock45 Shoots and reloads Brown Bess showing what an embuggerance it was.

    • Icebow

      As far I am concerned, pistol refers to either a revolver or a spring-fed automatic. ‘Handgun’ would seem superfluous, and anyhow what else but hands does one use with a rifle?

      • NickG

        what else but hands does one use with a rifle?

        I’m guessing you’ve never been a shooter! With a rifle one has a 4 point hold or lock. In addition to one’s hands, the weapon is braced against the shoulder and cheek. More… sometimes a 5th point is brought to bear too, by use of a sling tensioned against the upper arm. This is why a rifle provides for a much more stable and accurate shooting platform and most can cope with energy levels and commensurate recoil 5 or more times that generated by a typical handgun. Why rifle cartridges tend to be much more powerful than handgun cartridges.

        • Icebow

          I have done a bit of small-bore rifle shooting, rather a long time ago. You have a point, of course, but then again a rifle can be fired from the hip. If one lacks both hands, the shoulder and cheek are not of much help. I fully understand why rifles, all else being equal, are more powerful and accurate than pistols. Handgun doesn’t appear in the 1969 Concise OED I have to hand; I suspect it’s essentially an Americanism.

          • NickG

            a rifle can be fired from the hip

            Few will reliably hit a target beyond a few paces using this technique, so it’s best avoided. Which is why it is NOT taught as a CQB – close quarter battle – technique either side of the Atlantic.

            I suspect it’s essentially an Americanism.

            It is a term used both sides of the Atlantic. Indeed, until the post Dunblane attrocity handgun ban in the mid 90s, there was in circulation a monthly UK periodical called Handgunner. Now there are few handguns in use in the UK, outside of the small number in use by the police and military, so it’s not much of a topic, which brings us back to my initial point.

            Pistol shooting knowledge and skills in the UK, even in the military, are woeful. This was made abundantly clear when the UK military introduced the Glock17 pistol to replace the venerable Browning HP35 and it was showcased to the press by Royal Marines with embarrassingly awful pistol skills.

  • hobspawn

    Since they’ve disabled comments on the Erdogan limerick story I may as well post here.

    A friend of mine sent in a poem which I think was better than Boris’s winner. Here it is:

    A goat-herd called ‘Wretched’ Erdogan,
    Was ​sodding the goat he preferred again.
    He wiped off the curd,
    Said “Shh, Mutti’s the word”,
    Then dipped his delight in the ​turd again.

    Here is Boris’s:

    There was a young fellow from Ankara,
    Who was a terrific ​wankerer,
    Till he sowed his wild oats,
    With the help of a goat,
    But he didn’t even stop to thankera.

    If you think my friends’s effort is a worthier winner than Boris’s, please upvote this comment.

    • MikeF

      It’s probably as good though it might be better if the penultimate word was ‘herd’ since that would provide an imputation of insatiability. Boris’ effort is certainly witty but it doesn’t mention Erdogan either by name or title and though smutty fails to meet the benchmark of utter obscenity that Mr Murray was adamant would be a precondition of winning. Why no comments should allowed on this subject is rather perplexing. Perhaps they are afraid people will just post their entries but why ask for them in the first place if that is the case.
      I sent in two and the second of them certainly was obscene with a rhyme scheme that depended on the word endings ‘ucker’ and ‘ocks’. The first was a bit more restrained and I fail to see why I can’t post it here:
      The President of the Turks,
      If frustrated immediately jerks,
      Himself Off,
      Thinking of an English ‘Toff’,
      And not that sour Kraut Merks

      • Icebow

        Scansion problem.

      • hobspawn

        “It’s probably as good though it might be better if the penultimate word was ‘herd’ since that would provide an imputation of insatiability.”

        But sacrifices not only the simple comic pleasure of ‘turd’, but also the insult of rhyming it with Erdogan. Turd again is good.

        • MikeF

          Indeed – whatever. There are no absolutes in art.

    • Icebow

      Verse doesn’t seem to be quite Boris’s thing. ‘inveterate ​wankerer’ scans better, and ‘some goats’ rhymes better than ‘a goat’ (half-rhymes won’t do in limericks) — but that leaves us with ‘thankera’.

      • hobspawn

        Yes, inveterate is way better. So we have

        There was an old ​pervert from Ankara,
        Who was an inveterate ​wankerer,
        Till he emptied his ​scrote,
        In a German she-goat,
        But hadn’t the manners to thankera.

        (or even: Contracting a rare ​penile cankera.)

        • Icebow

          That’ll do!

        • MikeF

          But then she looked like a Panzer tankera.

    • Wandwaggler

      Here was my own poem first posted on Facebook

      AN EU SHOW TRIAL IN GERMANY OF ALL PLACES

      Jan Boerhmermann found guilty for a poem….

      A poem that stinks like the goat that cooks

      But with a smell that cannot smother

      A faint whiff of histories of burning books

      And above this poem’s jangle I hear another

      Sound as if of Crystal windows breaking

      How sad that Merkel’s German courts

      Are now before another tyrant quaking

      Let Brits Vote LEAVE AND GAIN A PEACE OF SORTS.

  • John

    Join UKIP Rod – you know it makes sense.

    • Duke Amir Often

      See, Liddle? This is where your gob-sh*ting takes you; they think you’re an aspirant Kipper.

      It’s all gone wrong.

      • Where did the left go right? UKIP are disorganised but the left is in complete moral collapse

        • Duke Amir Often

          But there’s more of them than there are of you and that’s what counts in this game.

          • Well no, what counts is having a coherent and defensible governing philosophy. Numbers has never counted, most people have always been apolitical

            And given that you’ve accepted that the left are in complete moral collapse, I’m not sure what your original point to Rodders was about

          • Duke Amir Often

            That he’s a c**t.

        • Leon Wolfeson

          Blaming the left for your issues…

      • John

        I was amazed to hear that Rod was a Labour supporter at all.

        • Leon Wolfeson

          I can’t see he is, just he was a member.

    • Leon Wolfeson

      Not eligible under UKIP rules as I understand it.

  • soysauce1

    Well Rod, if you are daft enough to belong to any political parties in the last 40 years (Apart from the glorious Thatcher years) then you have received your just puddings.

  • Johnny Foreigner ✓ Very angry

    Rod, I’d like to volunteer as your silent witness, ‘coz I’d like to meet Shami Chakrabartia, as well. I’d keep shtum, right up until they stick you in the stocks, then start to pelt you with rotten cabbage, I’d have a cup of tea/biscuit and a chat with Shami, this would really make my day.

  • Mc

    Nothing quite as amusing as a Stalinist party that doesn’t have the power to execute its critics, so holds show trials instead.

    • Leon Wolfeson

      Really? Where’s your party doing that then?

  • alberto

    for those who would like to help Mz Shami Chakrabarti uncover antisemitism in the labour party, here’s a useful link to the online questionnaire that will enable you to do so.

    http://www.labour.org.uk/index.php/chakrabarti

    • excellent, I’ll just pop out and hire several students for a month to fill in the details…quite a list!

  • Duke Amir Often

    “I am allowed to bring along a ‘silent witness’ —someone who is not permitted to intervene on my behalf but can sit beside me with a consolatory expression on their face”

    Ken Livingstone. Ring him up.

    You could sit for Ken in return.

    Rod and Ken. This is what it’s come to.

  • CK

    Virtually all Muslims in Labour–and everywhere else in the world, regardless of political affiliation–make no effort to hide their rampant antisemitism, so what’s the controversy here? Corbyn and Livingstone and other jokers vocally and unashamedly side with Muslims who view Jews as sub-human, and they act indignant when this is pointed out to them?

    • Leon Wolfeson

      So you blame all Muslims for your views, oh dear.
      As you claim that “Corbyn and Livingstone” stand with you…

    • Daidragon

      How do most Jews feel about muslims?

      • CK

        Not too positive and for good reason. What does that have to do with anything? Muslims are sworn to kill Jews, most Jews just want to get on with their lives.

        • RobertDeLuce

          Brought aboutt, M. Amnnesia, by the US and UK bombing their countries and hommes to pieces. All in the casuse of giving Israel more land to expand into. Did the Jews in the late 30’s hate the German Nazis, yes they did, because they were murdering their children. Damn it, so how you expect the people in Gaxa to feel.

          • Discuscutter

            The Islamic hatred of Jews goes back to the creation of the religion by Mohamed.

            He was virulently anti-semitic and after one battle he had about 900 jewish men and boys beheaded while the women were taken as slaves.

            Long before the creation of Israel, the jews were an obsession of the Islamic world and that is down to the religious commands therein.

          • CK

            Yep, the Jews of Banu Qurayza. That doesn’t fit the “not antisemitic but anti-Zionist” narrative of Jews all being from Eastern Europe, or that Islam has tolerated Jews and treated them fairly.

          • Snow

            You’re comparing Nazis murdering Jewish children in the 1930s to the US & UK recently in the Middle East ??

            That sounds like the ISIS official view. Very disturbing.

            Do you support the IS attacks in Brussels and Paris? Presumably the answer to that is yes.

            At least we all know what you are.

          • Rajmuld

            No, he’s not…He’s suggesting that neocon wars killing millions of Muslims while western powers “defend” and fund the right of Israel to “steal” Palestinian land, and to kill and maim Palestinians, doesn’t exactly endear Muslims to Israel…. Do remember too, that the World War II Holocaust had absolutely nothing to do with Muslims – it was carried out predominantly by white Europeans, many of them Christians. Punishing Muslims for these crimes, while (as above) killing, maiming and stealing from them is absolutely comparable to what the Nazis did to people they viewed as an inferior race (and if you read this thread, you will see it is dominated by racists who view Arabs and other Muslim races as inferior.)

          • Snow

            When I want an answer from a 3rd party I’ll ask for one. Butt out

          • Snow

            The holocaust was NOT a religiously motivated act. End of. The fact that you are implying it is, is repugnant. It is the kind of think I would imagine would come from a member of Islamic State sitting in Raqqa in the house of a slaughtered Christian family.

            The genocide being committed by Islamic State is religiously motivated. Fact. Expert on Islamic State Gaeme Wood in a lauded article in The Atlantic:

            “The reality is that the Islamic State is Islamic. Very Islamic. Yes, it has attracted psychopaths and adventure seekers, drawn largely from the disaffected populations of the Middle East and Europe. But the religion preached by its most ardent followers derives from coherent and even learned interpretations of Islam.”

            http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2015/03/what-isis-really-wants/384980

          • Snow

            And f you don’t like an article from a renowned expert published in a respected and often said to be liberal or left of centre, try this one from the Guardian

            “Most Arab states share Isis’s ideology”

            http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/oct/28/arab-states-share-isis-ideology-islam

            It beats Islamic State’s magazine “Dabiq” with which you may be acquainted

      • Malcolm Stevas

        I dare say pretty much the same as us indigenous English folk feel about them, which is to say, with individual exceptions, alarm and distaste at the enormous numbers of them here, and sadness at the transformation of large areas of urban England into a dystopian multi-culti snook-cocking parody of its former Englishness.

      • RobertDeLuce

        Absolute hatred, the ones I know anyway, eespecially in Israel, referring to themm in the same way the Nazis referred to the Jews. The Zionists are indeed Nazis.

        • mightymark

          The elision from “Jews” to “Zionists” here is noted. Are you simply more (perhaps accidentally?) honest than your brothers in arms who pretend strictly to quarantine the two?

    • RobertDeLuce

      One could, in a simiilar wide sweeping statemment, say that alll Jews are anti Muslim. I can’t confirm that, naturally, for unlike you I do not personallly know all of them. Mind you, had I made such a statement without them knowing all of them, virtually does not get you off the hook, then I would rightly be deemed a rracist. So, we know whhat that makes you then, yes.

      • CK

        That’s not a “wide-sweeping statement.” With several exceptions, Muslims are inherently antisemitic. Opinion polls all across the Arab and Muslim world has dislike of Jews among the populace in the 90+% range.

      • Snow

        Time to educate yourself then on the science of polling. It’s the marvel of modern science & statistics. You don’t actually have to know all the people in a group.

        Start with the article by Mehdi Hasan in tne New Statesmen
        http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/uk/2013/03/sorry-truth-virus-anti-semitism-has-infected-british-muslim-community

        He says “It pains me to have to admit this but anti-Semitism isn’t just tolerated in some sections of the British Muslim community; it’s routine and commonplace. Any Muslims reading this article – if they are honest with themselves – will know instantly what I am referring to. It’s our dirty little secret. You could call it the banality of Muslim anti-Semitism.”

        Then there is the recent ICM poll sponsored by Channel 4
        https://www.icmunlimited.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/Mulims-full-suite-data-plus-topline.pdf

        No less than 44 percent of Muslim’s agreed that Jews have too much power in the business world, 38 percent said Jews have too much control over global affairs, 39 percent said Jews have too much influence over the media, and 26 percent said that Jews are responsible for most of the world’s wars. Additionally, 34 percent agreed that “Jews still talk too much about what happened to them in the holocaust.” However, when questioned, only ten percent could accurately identify the number of Jews actually murdered in the Holocaust.

        Cautious estimates from other research suggest that Muslims may be responsible for somewhere between twenty and thirty percent of anti-Semitic incidents in Britain, despite making up only five percent of the population

        Please provide links to credible & respected surveys / polls showing that British Jews have similar mindsets about Muslims.

        Looking forward to that…

  • Simerall

    How can Shami Chakrabarti claim to be running an independent inquiry when she’s joined the Labour Party? Let’s supposing you were asked to investigate something in ‘Organisation X’. What would people think if you told them you were joining Organisation X before you investigated it? How Labour gets away with this rubbish God alone knows. Maybe it’s because news organisations like the BBC totally fail in their job to scrutinise Labour in the way they would other parties.

    • nail on head re BBC but you missed the significance: all the investigations into the BBC and research saying how unbiased the BBC is and how wonderful it is are run by the BBC!

      • Snow

        A lot say otherwise, demonstrating BBC is left leaning and biased:

        • Roger Mosey, former BBC editorial director: “BBC is dogged by liberal bias”, former chief admits. The BBC suffers from liberal “group think” and dysfunctional governance, one of its most senior figures of the past two decades has said in a his 2015 book. http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/news/uk/article4476635.ece

        • Peter Sissons BBC news reader: “At the core of the BBC, in its very DNA, is a way of thinking that is firmly of the Left.” in his book

        • A report, commissioned by the BBC Trust, found the BBC had been “slow” to catch up with public opinion on immigration and leaving the European Union and the BBC did not reflect the public view on immigration because of ‘deep liberal bias’

        • BBC presenter admits some of its audiences are politically biased: Jonathan Dimbleby said the Any Questions audience is not balanced

        • John Humphrys: BBC not sufficiently sceptical about Europe or immigration: BBC coverage of the EU and immigration issues has been biased to the Left, admits Radio 4 Today presenter John Humphrys http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/tvandradio/bbc/10688000/John-Humphrys-BBC-not-sufficiently-sceptical-about-Europe-or-immigration.html

        • Helen Boaden (former director of BBC news) claims the BBC has deep left bias: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/tvandradio/bbc/10158679/BBC-has-deep-liberal-bias-executive-admits.html

        • Martin Plaut, the outgoing editor of BBC’s World Service was quoted as saying “The Tories are lower than vermin”

        • Rod Liddle (former editor of BBC Radio 4’s Today programme): The bias (at the BBC) was crystal clear when I was there. It’s got much worse since.

        Great article by Rod Liddle in the Spectator “The bias (at the BBC) was crystal clear when I was there. It’s got much worse since” It starts with this:

        “The big story was the European Union; the splits occasioned by the EU within the Tory party and the battle, on the part of racist Neanderthal xenophobes, to keep us out of the Exchange Rate Mechanism, from which we had ignominiously exited three years before. The meeting cackled and hooted at the likes of Bill Cash and his assorted fascists on the Eurosceptic right. ‘They think the Germans are determined to dominate Europe!’ and ‘They’re just racists!’ and ‘They’re all old Monday Club little Englanders!’ How everyone laughed”

        • If the above was not enough the BBC has its very own website: http://www.BiasedBBC.org – essentially saying it has a left liberal bias, with hundreds of examples. There’s no website dedicated to claiming the BBC is too right wing

        From

        • Leon Wolfeson

          So claims. Not the actual studies on this, which have shown it’s pro-government.

          And you deny the evidence on, for instance, the Guardian…

          • Snow

            Leon, if you’d actually bothered to read my comment, you would have seen a report commissioned by the BBC Trust stated “found the BBC had been “slow” to catch up with public opinion on immigration and leaving the European Union and the BBC did not reflect the public view on immigration because of ‘deep liberal bias'”

            This is why almost everyone on this forum has complete contempt from you and you have zero credibility. You’re characterized as a troll that everyone points at and laughs

          • RobertDeLuce

            Insullts like that clearly demosnttrate that you have rreached the bottom of the barrel in your desperate serach for something to say.

          • Snow

            One could more easily say the same about your comment. Yours says nothing, mine makes the point that the troll in question had not bothered to read my previous comment – and obviously neither had you

          • Change your name to Robert LeDunce Bob… Much more apt. Have you had any contact with the lunatic Wolfeson? Clearly not.

          • Leon Wolfeson

            ….It’s been pro-government all along.

            And the LibDems were unpopular in coalition, yes, but that has little to do with the left.

            As you claim to be almost everyone, as you spew your PC bigotry at me, demanding I be like you, in your hatred.

          • Snow

            You seriously need help Leon.

          • Leon Wolfeson

            Yes, of course you seriously want me beaten by thugs.

            All for using facts.

          • Snow

            Send us a link to these studies and the Guardian article.

          • Leon Wolfeson

            I don’t give multiple personalities information, per long-standing policy.

          • Snow

            Proof for all to see you are a bogus liar, plus you use mental illness for personal abuse.

          • Leon Wolfeson

            No, I am not you, and it’s not abuse not to make things worse by providing said information.

          • “And you deny the evidence on, for instance, the Guardian…”

            Bwaa ha ha ha ha ha ha ha…….

          • Leon Wolfeson

            Yea, creepy laughter and not evidence, right.

          • Aghhhhhhh Bwah ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha – hoot – Bwah ha ha ha ha..

          • Leon Wolfeson

            Yes, all you have, I agree.

          • Ha ha ha ha h ah arghhhhhh hah hah hah ha….

        • Cassandra

          I engaged in a somewhat acerbic conversation with the BBC last year about the content of the BBC History website, a widely-used resource for schools. It essentially claimed that Muslims invented everything. I made a formal complaint.

          My detailed letter, complete with academically-respectable references, examined every claim on the website and pointed out that in each case, the inventions were Greek, part of the Classical heritage to which Muslims gained access when they invaded Byzantium, Alexandria and the West. I cited Islamic Golden Age texts in which the authors directly acknowledge they’re responding to Aristotle or Hippocrates.

          The BBC grudgingly said they would send my comments out for consultation. Eventually, they agreed to revise the wording on the website. But that was one page in one section of a large resource area. Day after day, the next generation is denied access to the originators of the Western heritage, and taught that a religion which, after an initial phase of openness, began closing down “heretical” thought, is the foundation of Western culture. I appeal to scholars who can put in some time to reassert the value of the Classical legacy, which both invented and recorded the birth of democracy and science for the West. Ignorance makes for unopposed brainwashing.

          • MikeF

            Yes I have had the odd spat with the BBC and Channel 4. A few years back a replica of the infamous slave ship the Zong sailed up the Thames to mark the 200th anniversary of the abolition of the slave trade. It was the occasion a lachrymose Ken Livingstone presumed to apologise for the slave trade. Now the incident in in 1783 in which the original ship was involved was certainly atrocious – over a hundred enslaved Africans were thrown overboard in mid-Atlantic because they became diseased and the outrage at the incident helped spur on the abolitionist movement.
            The captain of the Zong was one Luke Collingwood who actually died of fever the following year. But the news reports that evening on both the BBC and Channel 4 all attributed the blame for the action to Admiral Lord Collingwood, who was second-in-command to Nelson at Trafalgar over two decades later in 1805. In other words the sheer ignorance of some television researcher providing background material to both channels meant that the whole nation was being falsely told that one of Britain’s greatest naval heroes was a cold-blooded murderer of black Africans.
            I phoned both channels pointing out that this was a gross factual error and to be fair the BBC acknowledged what I was saying and may even have altered the content of their broadcasts though whether they ever actually issued a retraction I don’t know. The Channel 4 switchboard, however, rather sniffily told me that the newsroom ‘did not take calls from the public’.
            But well done. Your correspondence would make good reading.

          • Cassandra

            What an interesting story! I’m glad I have comrades in standing against the tide.

            I love the BBC, & think it’s fixable, but only if we have a cultural revolution.

          • MikeF

            Yes we have stand together though I am not sure the BBC is fixable.

        • I have no problem with your general direction in this post, but just felt I should point out that biasedbbc.org is not the BBC’s ‘own’ website. It is a website dedicated to pointing out that the BBC is biased to the left. It is of course; I’m not arguing with that, but they don’t run that website. It would be easy to read into your remark above that they own and run it.

          Cheers

    • singthethemetoon

      She joined the party to show “good faith” and to indicate she was not on a witch hunt. Some such rubbish.
      Although by that logic I expect an announcement of her upcoming conversion to Judaism any day now.

  • Leon Wolfeson

    So given your mixing up your spam box and the Labour parties mailings… as you show why your attempt to infiltrate Labour has ended so badly, lol.

    • Malcolm Stevas

      “Infiltrate” is stupid and impertinent. Did you not read Liddle’s mention of his having been a Labour member for 37 years? This is possibly longer than you’ve been on the planet… Why does a creeping Leftist like you “infiltrate” this forum, one wonders.

      • So he can accuse people of being ‘Jew haters’ when they disagree with him. You need not mention ‘Jews’ or even discuss any matter pertaining to ‘Jews’ for this to happen. Neither do you need to even know that he claims to be a Jew. After some disagreement with him, by virtue of his suddenly claiming to be a Jew, any disagreement you had with him becomes by definition (his definition) ‘Jew Hatred’, and you may be referred to by him thereafter as a ‘Jew Hater’.

      • Leon Wolfeson

        No, it’s a fact based on this article.

        As you whine, in your PC bigotry, about the existence of other mainstream views. Which I’m quite open about.

        • Malcolm Stevas

          You confirm your ignorance of the meaning of “fact”, repeatedly demonstrated in your earlier posts.

          • Leon Wolfeson

            So you blame me for your fantasy that you’ve wiped the term from my mind, as you admit you haven’t read the article, and as you deny other mainstream views exist!

          • Malcolm Stevas

            As usual, your incomprehension is matched by your inability to make a comprehensible response.

          • Leon Wolfeson

            Blaming me for your posts and your poor reading ability is sad.

  • Innit Bruv

    So the Labour have finally woken up and decided they may not want a boorish clodhopper like Mister Piggy as one of their members. What took them so long?

  • Wandwaggler

    Labour only singled out Rod Liddle of The Spectator for trial by torment, because he has a column (and though I am gay, sorry, Mrs Backcomber, but truth must “OUT” as must I, that is not a sexual remark). I constantly campaign for Muslims to STOP misusing the word “Islamophobe”, because, as a gay man, fear of Quranic hate-speak is my “thing” and I want and need “Islamophobe” to use in its true sense, to mean “fear of Islam”. Shami Sack-your-butti won’t trifle with me after Rod Liddle because I am not a target that has any “fame” and I claim to be a true Corbynista. And she is simply a role-player for the Liberty woman (Libertine?) Why, the real Shami doesn’t even reply to my emails to Liberty. Notches on any Labour investigator’s gun need to be of substance, denoting the death of someone also of substance, like former Mayor Ken No-longer-Living-stone . Perhaps my abuse of her name might qualify me for”inclusion”. She is welcome to abuse my name which Microsoft spell checker used to transform from “Vernon Moyse” into “Vermin Mousse” – at a time when I was in charge, inter alia, of pest control operatives! Tickled me pink, did that. But some feministas are too po-faced, in my experience, like that dreadful Laura Kuenssberg who miraculously appeared as BBC Political Editor in an act of transcendental magic worthy of enshrinement by the Catholic Church. Oddly her emergence as a piece of weeping statuory seems to have crushed candidates such as Fiona Bruce (whom God preserve though not of Utrecht) and James Landale. Ms Kuenssberg appears (magically) at every opportunity and tells us things that we already know or could guess, things that are simply vapid or things that betray a certain thirst for sensationalism in the mould of Paxman (which mould is far too mouldy now). Now have I, who have abandoned hope of any socialist aspiration in the leadership, done enough to get suspended from the disintegrating Labour Party? I shall appear before any tribunal with my own silent witness, Emilia Fox, dressed in a white shift and carrying the head of Ken Livingstone in a velvet bag. More at http://www.facebook.com/Backcomber

  • CRPC

    I must say, I’m rather surprised to learn that Rod Liddle is a member of the Labour Party.

  • Tony Buchanan

    I’ve never quite ‘got’ the silent witness thing at hearings. The only time I needed one- at work for a disciplinary issue (walking from the office in a flounce) – it was like asking people for their hand in marriage to attend. In the end I dragged in poor Peter from accounts because he once lent me a Michelle Branch CD. He smiled like an idiot throughout and ended up nodding in agreement with everything HR and my accusers said. Utter nonsense.

  • Andrew Cole

    congenital idiot and Guardian journalist Owen Jones Resident on the Beeb Labour is “proud to defend” whenever they want to portray the Northern working class as still “Doon Pit” or “T’at Forge”.

    Maybe young Owen will venture back up Noorf and see things have changed just a bit since the 70s. I suspect he already knows that but then if he painted the North as having moved on he wouldn’t sell so many books or get as many invitiations to espouse how the “hard done to Northerners” have been hit by the Tory cuts when the reality is it is Nu-Labour’s policies that left masses of Northerners out of work as all the employers dirty little palms got sweaty at the prospect of profits when they saw the cheap labour tap open to full.

    As for Chakrabarti. Another crazy appointment. The only thing she ever does is gob off at anyone who might have an opinion on anything. Another shouty lefty quite happy to abuse the capitalist gravy train while pretending to be standing up for [insert who they have decided is a victim without asking them].

    Pass me the gun.

  • Malcolm Stevas

    Well, Rod, if you’re so unwise (to say the least) as to be a card-carrying member of the Labour Party, as a man of mature years and decades’ worth of experience of that Party, then you’ve got it coming. Sorry, but although you write a great deal of good sense, in this instance I have no sympathy at all. A Party that consistently s c rews the economy and indeed the country as a whole is not going to think twice about messing with a single member. Look on the bright side: they might expel you! Without even one mighty bound, you’ll be free…

  • picquet

    Please – please, please, have the ‘interview’ filmed. I promise to buy a new subscription to the Spectator if you do.

    What about these pans, then? Are they worth their price?

  • JohnnyNorfolk

    How many years have you been a member !!!. You are a fool sir.

    • ilPugliese

      He’s hedging Johnny. We hardly see you at all on Not the Telegraph Letters now. Was it something someone said?

      • JohnnyNorfolk

        I now have a sub with The Times. You can comment on EVERY story.

  • Freeuk Militia

    Ode to Trump:
    There once was a duplicitous toad called Khan,
    Who defended those that wished us harm,
    And who preached all day..against those that say,
    They did not care for I s lam.
    simon 2016

  • Freeuk Militia

    Liberty, Khan and the other ji hadi lawyers who spend there time using the shield of diversity to protect evil are a national security threat and should be removed by all means

  • Jackthesmilingblack

    Thought crime: Lot of it about in YUCK.

  • jeffersonian

    ‘Rod Liddle: Labour’s putting me on trial for thought crime’

    Might be a teeny indication that he’s perhaps in the wrong party? Just a thought.

    • RobertDeLuce

      Yes, another Tory prettending to be Labour. I wonder if he views whatt Israel does to children in GGaza as racist, anti-something or other, he might even see it as Jews having a dim view of Palestinians. Does he, I wonder, object to the holocaust that is in the making in Gaza. Yes, wrong party and maybe wrong Country too.

      • CK

        You idiots can’t use language like “Holocaust” in Gaza, or that Israel “kills” children. The first is nowhere on a similar scale, and no deaths of Gazans in any of the Gaza conflicts–all started by Hamas, which has actual genocide in its charter, by the way–are intentional. The second is just simply not true. People die in conflict, but to suggest that IDF personnel summarily execute children, or anyone else, is nothing short of a horrible lie.

        That says nothing of Israeli children loudly and openly targeted by Arab terrorists while you leftist a-holes are silent.

        • Cassandra

          Indeed. The Palestinians must be the only victims of genocide in human history whose population, by some miracle, nevertheless grows exponentially. Those murderous Israelis must be really inept.

          • CK

            How morally and intellectually bankrupt do you have to be that retaliating against a party in a conflict sworn to your complete and utter destruction constitutes “genocide” on YOUR part? To say nothing of the wild population explosion as you mentioned.

          • Trailblazer10

            White British are decreasing rapidly, soon to be a minority in their own homelands. Similar pattern across Western nations. Identity politics ( power of feminism), political correctness, mass 3rd world immigration.

          • Cassandra

            Read my other posts below. Then you’ll have a clue about the tone of my comment.

          • CK

            I understand what you’re saying fully. My question broadly asks any “Palestinian” supporter who throws around such egregiously false labels.

      • jeffersonian

        …and you seem to inhabit the wrong reality. Talk to your Dr.

      • The Masked Marvel

        “Holocaust that is in the making in Gaza”? LOL!

        Current population of Gaza: 1,816,379 (July 2014 est.)

        Based on current growth, the population (according to different projections) is expected to increase to 2.13 million by 2020 and 2.76 million by 2028, which would result in a population density of 7,562 people per km. The annual population growth rate for Gaza in 2011 stood at a high 3.37%, resulting from a fertility rate of 4.9 children per woman in 2010, compared to 3.8 in the West Bank. The population growth rate in Gaza is forecast to decline moderately to 2.99% by 2020.

        Source: UNRWA.org

        Most. Incompetent. Holocaust. Ever.

        Stupid Jews can’t even do a Holocaust properly, eh? Why not just write “Jews are a vile race who must be exterminated!” in all caps on a text document and save it to the desktop so you can simply copy and paste as needed? It would save you loads of time and effort, and you’d look less of an idiot.

        • Rajmuld

          Yes, evil people like you LOLed when Israeli terrorists murdered 500 plus children in Gaza in the summer of 2014. You LOLed when little boys playing football on a beach were torn to pieces. You LOLed when Israeli land thieves burnt Palestinian babies to death, or poured high explosives on their homes……And there you are setting out the birth rates of your hated enemy: just like Eichmann did. You are a vile extremist, just like the Israelis who sat on a hill with their popcorn and LOLed as Gaza burned, along with its men, women and children.

          • Malcolm Stevas

            Your comment belongs in the cartoon tradition of gross caricature.

          • The Masked Marvel

            Hardly. You’re a sick human being if you think that. No wonder rthere’s no chance for peace if your attitude is prevalent on the anti-Israel side. No human decency whatsoever, while pretending to care about the lives of Palestinian children. If you really cared about them, you’d be at least equally angry at Hamas.

          • investigator

            Poor little Muslim victims.
            You know, the day is coming, and it can’t be far off, when mosques will be blown up all over the west, and imams will be imprisoned or executed or exiled to Saudi Arabia. Then they will wish they had been executed.

          • g1lgam3sh

            There is no such thing as ‘Palestinian’ babies.

            Here’s the Interior Minister of Hamas confirming that obvious truth.

            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bd3tA_dAl-A

          • Maureen Fisher

            Syrians are pretty good at that stuff too. When Assad gasses his own people where are the demos and placards” We are all Hezbollah.”. Did you all forget that Hezbollah are busy doing Assad’s work?

      • Andrew Smith

        There is a long tradition of socially-conservative, patriotic, England-centric yet socially-concerned thinking within the Labour party. This is after all the party of Ernest Bevin, Jim Callaghan, Roy Mason and Joel Barnet.

        Rod Liddle stands firmly within this tradition. I find it nauseating whenever anyone in the Labour party (of which I am not a member and would never join) who doesn’t sign up to the middle class metro-liberalism, is decried as being a Tory. These people believe in nationalisation and high public spending for goodness sake!

  • Give our God Immortal Praise

    The reality dare I say it is negrophiles and moslem bum-lickers have ruined this country.

    • jeffersonian

      I’m astonished you got that past the mods 😉

  • Corbyn is the Face of Fascism

    Why would any decent person want to be associated with the ever more increasingly fascist left wing Labour party anyway? Was their cover up of muslim grooming gangs in their councils not enough?

    • CK

      The Bizarro World mentality of the left is truly fascinating–and nauseating.

    • SonOfaGun

      New Labour was extremely dangerous for British schoolgirls in ‘multicultural’ areas.

  • Maureen Fisher

    I noticed the “vibrant enrichment” spiel about Syrian migrants in Malmo, Sweden had about 115 comments with as many deleted comments before it was closed by Guardian Towers on Komment Macht Frei. The spiel was along the lines of before the migrants arrived, all Swedes ate was sausages. Now they eat falafel and are therefore culturally enriched. I am sure Rod would write something withering and not to the likes of our dear Shami about this.

    • Malcolm Stevas

      I like your acidulous style, Ma’am – and I’m going to steal “Komment Macht Frei”…

      • Maureen Fisher

        I’m afraid it’s not original but penned by Mr Delingpole of this parish.

    • CEO Daffodil

      Unfortunately I can’t tell you where – I’ve forgotten – but I once read that a store owner in Malmo, herself of immigrant descent, said she gets robbed once a month. It was in a news item about her chasing out a guy with a gun from her shop.
      Somehow I don’t imagine shop owners were burgled once a month back in 1970s Sweden.

  • chalkhillblue

    Like others I am tempted to ask why you bother being the Labour Party any more, but given that it seems the thought police are out to get you – a prospect which I have been worried about for some time – may I say that you have my support.

    • MikeF

      Maybe this is what Rod has been hoping for. Like others I look forward to his report of the meeting but I fear all he may have to recount is that every point he made was met with complete and utter incomprehension.

  • Rob74

    I want to ask you a question.

    At what point in your life did the Labour Party capture you with its obvious love of the working class?

  • polidorisghost

    He who communes with pigs gets dirty.

    • Roger Hudson

      Is that what you call it?

  • Cornelius Bonkers

    Sami Crackchapati, yes, I’d like to meet her too. I will say: “On matters of liberty, who asked you to speak on my behalf?”. I’ll also want to know what she meant when appearing on Woman’s Hour when she said she felt more comfortable being with her own people (or words to that effect – it was a long time ago). Doesn’t sound very liberal to me. And has anyone read her recent semi-literate attempt at authorship? I really can’t stand her self righteousness; does any one not living north London like her?

    • Sargon the bone crusher

      Everyone feels more comfortable with their own people. I am comfortable with clever, rich, ruthless crushers of all proles. Home sweet home.

      • Cornelius Bonkers

        Dear Mr Crusher, of course, we all feel more comfy with our own. BUT most of us don’t make a living from claiming and promoting the opposite….She really is a censorious hypocrite of the worst possible kind. I’d love to be there when she demands that Rod appear before her to have his intentions picked over. I’m guessing Torquemada could have learned a thing or two from her. What price a front seat at the coming auto da fe?

    • Nick

      I can’t stand her either Cornelius as she represents all that is wrong with the political metropolitan elite.

  • DollarPound

    Rod, you should be thankful that you still have the gift of freedom of speech with which to apologise for using … err … your freedom of speech…

  • MikeF

    Rather a revealing image Ms Chakrabati – the overall tone is a mix of winsomeness and self-regard.

  • godot

    The pendulum has swung so far left, the only place it can go is far right.

  • mattghg

    This will be fun to hear about.

  • SonOfaGun

    “You over there! Stop being islamophobic!” “You over there! Stop being antisemitic!” “You over there! Stop being Christian!” What a shame, the international brigade is barely holding it together.

  • PAC1960

    Muslims aren’t anti-semitic. Huge numbers of them are anti-Jewish.

  • CalUKGR

    Surely, Rod, you can just tell this Labour kangaroo court to get stuffed? I mean, why would you put yourself through this charade at all? Perhaps you just want to go and laugh at them. I can think of no other sensible reason why you might dignify such idiocy with a response.

  • PAC1960

    Harry. A totalitarian fascist. A bully. A bigot. An imbecile. Undemocratic. Reactionary. Divisive. The Labour Party. Scraping the barrel for any cause and encouraging ‘victiming’ to look like the agony aunt party just to get votes…..etc.

    • Ian Reissmann

      “A totalitarian fascist. A bully. A bigot. An imbecile. Undemocratic. Reactionary. Divisive.”

      Yes … that’s a perfect description.

      Of Liddle 🙂

      • MuslimJew

        “Yes … that’s a perfect description.

        Of Liddle :-)”

        Yep.

  • Ari Lieberman

    This article is classic

  • Ian Reissmann

    Rod – please explain which Labour values you believe you possess which makes you part with £13 per month. Have you never heard of the Groucho principle?

  • Lawrence13

    Rob you think your emails are bad I get penis reduction spam all the bloody time. How do they know so much personal stuff.

  • Lawrence13

    Your use of the word ‘infantile’ really does sum up the western white luvvie (sorry Tom Conti) lefty classes. Its almost as if they hate their own upbringings when they would rail against Mother and Father for working hard for their great lifestyle . They then leave home and have to redirect this self-loathing elsewhere and that is the west, America, England (not Britain) and Israel. They also show total contempt for a Christian faith that has been vanishing since post WWII, but they act as if its been barbarically oppressive and all go around wearing the I am an atheist and therefore a person of great intelligence badge.
    But ironically they still feel the need to worship so they pray to man made global warming and Gaia and they also as seen with the BBC seem obsessed and very forgiving of Islam which is no more violent than our wicked Christianity, no its better, as seen by the supposed plethora middle east geniuses that would have changed the course of mankind if it hadn’t been for those vicious crusaders-who by the way were quite tame compared to the Mongols and the benevolent Saracens.
    So yes Rob it is almost an extension of a very well looked after child hood teen ingrate rebellion that carries on into the fifties at least.

    • ilPugliese

      In my memory, there were so-called Christians who were oppressive, but not barbarically so. I expect they were nothing to do with Christianity.

  • Lawrence13

    Rod, I should have said an hilarious article. I’m surprised though that you are in the Labour Party, how can you stand it?

  • rob f

    have you got the address of the woman in basingstoke? i’m not far.. lol

  • wisestreligion

    Rod Liddle, Labour? How can someone who is evidently not an obedient zombie of Britain’s now compulsory religion, of PC liberal leftism, last more than a few weeks in the Labour Party? Did you join just for the fun of electing J Corbyn? OK, Cameron’s Tory party does its best to imitate Labour, but there is still UKIP if one feels compelled to join a political party but would rather not surrender one’s brain.

    • ilPugliese

      Perhaps he is there to reform them. Just as Britain is in the EU to reform it!!!

  • Sanchez

    Why don’t we all join the Labour party? Then we can screw it up from within, just like all the lefty liberals who have infiltrated the Tories. Alternatively, we could try and swing it to the right and make it more socially conservative.

  • Matt Pryor

    Dear Rod,

    When facing your inquisitors it might be worth pointing them in the direction of the Anti-Defamation League research which shows that in 2015, the prevalence of anti-Jewish attitudes among major religious groups in the UK was as follows:

    – Christian: 13%
    – Atheist: 10%
    – Muslim: 54%

    Source: http://global100.adl.org/#country/united-kingdom/2015

    And if you click around to Muslim-majority countries you’ll see that it’s as high as 93%. It gets worse and worse the closer you get to Hamastine / Fatahstine.

    There is also this piece by Mehdi Hasan – perhaps you could recommend that they throw him out of the Party too (assuming he’s a member):

    http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/uk/2013/03/sorry-truth-virus-anti-semitism-has-infected-british-muslim-community

  • Maureen Fisher

    The original remit was to investigate anti Semitism, then they realised that most of their suspensions were Muslims, so they quickly had to do an about turn and make it all about “Islamophobes.”. Do they think anyone is thick enough to be taken in by this ruse?

    • Verk

      Yes, they do. They think they’re clever and everyone else is thick.

      • Richard

        They’re not clever, but everyone else is certainly thick.

        • Verk

          A lot of them are, yes. Not all though…

  • CEO Daffodil

    I’m a member of the Greens for 2 years. The pro-mass immigration, no borders and white guilt idiocy among its supporters will likely push me back to the Lib Dems, which is probably where I’m more at home with other secularists.

    • Trailblazer10

      “The pro-mass immigration, no borders and white guilt idiocy” That also describes the Lib Dems, the Vichy Tories, and Labour.

  • Lighthouse25

    Yet more evidence that if certain sections of the Labour Party and Guardian gain power, Britain will become a police state in very short order. This whole sad scenario is straight out of East Germany, and the tragedy of it is, none of the fools involved in dragging Rod Liddle before their kangaroo court have the slightest awareness of this fact.

  • Lighthouse25

    I’ll wager Harry moonlights as a Guardian ‘moderator’.

  • Richard

    I am interested to know why they have responded to this piece of yours, and didn’t do so for your rather stronger piece in 2005? Could it merely be that the Muslim population has probably doubled in the intervening time, and that twice the number of votes are at stake?

    https://spectator.com.au/comic/why-labour-does-not-need-the-jews/

  • Nick McBain

    Rod Liddle a member of Labour? I’m astonished it’s lasted this long, with titles like ‘Even fruitcakes and fascists are more popular than the flaccid centre’, ‘How moderate are moderate Muslims?’ (answer – they’re all extreme), ‘Why I feel compelled to defend Boris’, and ‘If you’re stupid enough to let migrants in, at least treat them as people’.

  • Ian Young

    Maybe Rod has been caught in the crossfire like Jackie Walker but when an opposition party is wasting time and political capital explaining to the populist tabloid press (that an opportunist troll like Liddle is a part of) they are losing. It’s good to see Labour taking is taking a no-nonsense approach instead of wasting time defending Liddle’s limp-wristed caveats and excuses. It’s politics not a vicar’s tea party get over Rod.

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